I see Jobim and his crusade for the Rafale is still alive and kicking.
Last edited by Olybrius; 02-24-2011 at 06:13 AM. Reason: cited 2 times kuwait
Regarding the Kaveri engine :
2 questions : does this increase Rafale's chances in this tender? Any prospects for SNECMA to get to build that engine for non indian Rafales too?Kaveri Update In Parliament
India's Kaveri turbofan engine programme came up in Parliament today. Here's what the House was told: "It is proposed to develop production version Kaveri (K10) engine on co-design & co-development basis with M/s Snecma, France...
Having a indigenous Engine for Rafale, How does it will effect the unit price of Rafale ?
It obviously should! The Kaveri - Snecma engine is planned with around 90 to 95kN thrust and to replace GE 404 in the first LCAs during MLU, it is also meant for the Indian 5. gen fighter AMCA (if it will be developed), but both only in a timeframe of 10 to 15 years.
If the engine could be integrated into Rafale for MMRCA instead, it could come during the licence production in India, planned from 2015 onwards!
Also, the development of the engine will be funded anyway, which means only integration into Rafale would cost additional money. On the other hand, the licence production of Snecmas M88 engine in India would cost money as well, not to forget that India would not be dependent on foreign vendors and could upgrade the engine later for Indian needs.
All in all this could be a very big advantage and I do hope that France and Dassault will try to combine the deals of UAE and India together. Kaveri-Snecma offers the thrust that the UAE wants as well, further upgrades of capabilities, or like the article from IDEX said:
would be important for India too. Both would be the perfect long term strategic partners for such a upgraded Rafale version and could share the costs with France....the UAE was right to think about the Rafale's capabilities in terms of its long-term needs, and was always looking to the future.
"There are some discussions to improve the basic aircraft into what could be the Rafale of the year 2020, 2025, 2030," he said.
About the Kaveri:
From:Defence Minister AK Antony on the Kaveri engine, replying today to a question in parliament
Broadsword, feb 24
PRESS INFORMATION BUREAU (DEFENCE WING)
GOVERNMENT OF INDIA
KAVERI ENGINE DEVELOPMENT PROJECT
New Delhi: Phalguna 04, 1932
February 23, 2011
So far, nine prototypes of Kaveri engines and 4 prototypes of Kaveri Core (Kabini) engines have been developed. About 1975 hours of testing has been conducted on Kaveri and its Core engines at ground and altitude conditions.
Kaveri engine prototype (K9) has been integrated with IL-76 Aircraft at Gromov Flight Research Institute, Russia. After adequate Engine Ground Runs, taxi trials, the maiden flight test of Kaveri engine with IL-76 Aircraft for over one hour has been successfully completed on 3rd November 2010 followed by 3 more flight tests. These flight tests covered 6 Km altitude and a speed of 0.6 mach.
Kaveri engine development project was sanctioned on 30th March 1989 with a Probable Date of Completion (PDC) of December 1996 and a cost of Rs.382.81 crore. The project cost was revised to Rs.2839.00 crore. Some of the major reasons for time and cost overruns are ab-initio development of engine, lack of skilled manpower in engine manufacturing, enhancement in the scope of project during development, lack of infrastructure for engine manufacture testing and component/system level testing within the country, Flying Test Bed (FTB) trials was not originally included as a milestone in the project, engine and component failure during testing which is inevitable in this kind of projects resulted in changes in design and material, based on various reviews, less priority from foreign manufacturing agencies in view of Minimum Order Quantity (MOQ) vis-a-vis the production order quantity from other engine houses and US sanctions imposed during 1998 affected the delivery of critical systems and components.
It is proposed to develop production version Kaveri (K10) engine on co-design & co-development basis with M/s Snecma, France. The technical evaluation for this proposal has been completed. Tender Purchase Committee (TPC) with members from DRDO, Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL), Indian Air Force (IAF), Indian Navy (IN) and Integrated Finance (R&D) is negotiating the commercial aspects.
According to Le Point France is proposing Iraq 20 UAE Mirage 2000-9:
- Payment would be made with oil.
- Some 2000-9 have also been proposed to Pakistan (too expensive for them) and Romania.
- UAE want 1.5 billion euros for their 2000-9.
- In addition, France proposes 18 Mirage F1, for which Iraq would only pay the upgrade.
For the record:
You speak about Chinese pressure. What kind? I mean, European industry is dying now and Chinese sensible economic sectors are getting closed to foreign investments. The new step, coming up next in Europe, is the inflow of chinese workers, same as we can see in northern Africa... I wonder how long this weakening Europe will let em do that.
I just can t remember the context when France sold the Mirage fighters to Taiwan in the 90s.