The French say that a fleet of 18 "Rafale" would be more effective than 22 selected Swedish Gripen.
"It's correct," confirmed to the newspaper a senior military who wished to remain anonymous.The capacity assessment of the aircraft by the Confederation would have shown that three"Rafale" or three"Eurofighter"amounted to five "Gripen".This difference is explained by the low range of the Swedish aircraft .
Also,when buying the "Rafale", France is committed to providing the Swiss army unlimited access to its air bases, the paper reports.TheSwiss pilot could thus not only land
in France during the day but also remain there several weeks.This offer also provides for the use of firing ranges and overflight zones in the Mediterranean, as well as flight simulators, while giving access to French logistics during international exercises.
http://www.challenges.fr/economie/20...es-rafale.html
Last edited by leloup46; 01-29-2012 at 10:51 AM.
Indian is still in the process of evaluating the offers, any new unsolicited offer from the contenders could be seen as a try to influence the ongoing process.Originally Posted by Herman the II
For Switzerland it's different, choice was done but irregularities have appeared (like Gripen ranked last and below the requirements limit).
interesting part in the comment section of Kovy's blog :
http://rafalenews.blogspot.com/2012/...ikes-back.html
from the same person :I'm the author of the article in the "Matin Dimanche" and the "SonntagsZeitung" / twitter: @titusplattner
@raffeur Yes, it's all includes weapons, ammo, infrastructure, etc. Simulator is not necessary, because swiss pilots will have the training slots in France.
the CHF 2.7 billions for 18 Rafale is with a change rate of CHF 1.20 for 1 euro
the CHF 4.0 billions for 22 Rafale was calculated with a change rate of 1.30 for 1 euro, as asked by the Swiss Federal departement of finance
that means that Dassault (who wants to be paid in euro) made a discount of about 15%.
The swiss evaluation had ten modules. The Rafale won the two flight modules (flight tests + projected flight capabilities).
The Rafale also won the module about the ability to maintain a an alert status during a long period, and the module about military cooperation.
For the noise pollution module, the three competitors had about the same score. These results are public:
http://www.offiziere.ch/wp-content/u...k02F2kV1w&ct=w
This is also the case for the industrial cooperation module. EADS, Dassault and Saab had about the same score. But Saab has more contracts with Ruag, (100% state owned).
The five other modules are unknown yet. But there is a financial module, a module about the "Eignung" (adequacy to Switzerland - infrastructure). I guess there were also weapon module and an avionics module. And a module about about aircraft maintenance
Gripen won the financial module and the module about aircraft maintenance costs. These two scores allowed the Gripen to (just) reach the minimal note of 6/10.
If you have any infos for me, please contact me at titus.plattner@edipresse.ch
http://www.offiziere.ch/wp-content/u...0009428255.ppt
From:Swiss govt says has not had cheaper Dassault offer
R euters, Jan 30
ZURICH, Jan 30 (*******) - Switzerland's defence ministry has not received a second offer from aircraft maker Dassault that is cheaper than the type of fighter jet it is planning to buy, a spokeswoman said on Monday.
"No official offer has been received here until now," a spokeswoman for the defense ministry said.
[...]
Citing a letter it had seen, the SonntagsZeitung reported that Dassault, which originally offered 22 Rafales for 4 billion francs, said it was never able to optimise its offer based on Switzerland's needs.
Now the Swiss government has decided what kind of plane to buy, that has become part of an armaments programme which is voted on by parliament, the defence ministry spokeswoman said.
Although parliament could reject it, the procurement effort would then have to begin again from scratch, with all competitors able to submit fresh bids, she said.
[...]
http://www.*******.com/article/2012/...8CU19N20120130
It seems clear now that Dassault does not expect anything from the swiss gov. and wants to obtain a rejection vote by the parliament.
http://www.expatica.com/ch/news/swis...rt_204568.html[...]"Yes, I have received this letter," Hans Hess of the parliament's security commission told the newspaper.[...]
Google translated from:For Keckeis , the Dassault offer is "almost a gift»
NZZ online, Jan 30
Old army chief would respond to the offer of the Rafale manufacturer
[...]
Christophe Keckeis, the former head of the Swiss Army, says "the offer from Dassault is "almost a gift", he told the Western Swiss Radio RSR. "18 Rafale are more advantageous than 22 Gripen, because the French jet is simply better".
[...]
http://www.romandie.com/news/n/PRESS...0120120601.asp
http://www.nzz.ch/nachrichten/politi....14658363.html
Keckeis , like other former swiss military leaders (F. Carrel..) , supports the Rafale and often goes against U.Maurer
http://archives.tdg.ch/christophe-ke...rer-2010-07-28
Epinal , Sept 2011:
From:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tempete_de_pixel/
Tactical leadership Program, 2012-1 ,Albacete , Jan 20:
From Jan 16 to Feb 10, 2 Rafale C from Saint-Dizier and 6 Mirage 2000 take part in the first Tactical Leadership Program of 2012.
http://www.albacete-airbase.com/apps...=2012&period=1
http://tlp.scramble.nl/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/galeria_angel_llamas/sets/72157628914381999/with/6743169947/
Saab Says Swiss Gripen Jet Fighter Decision May Take All Year
Saab AB (SAABB), which won a tentative Gripen jet fighter order with Switzerland, said final negotiations may take all year and that it’s “natural” that rival Dassault Aviation SA (AM) is still fighting for a deal.
“It’s not surprising they haven’t given up,” Erik Magni, a Saab (SAS)spokesman, said today by phone. It’s “part of the game” that Dassault is still competing, he said.
Saab and Switzerland are holding negotiations that probably will “take up all of 2012,” Magni said, adding the country’s parliament has yet to make a decision and that the nation may hold a referendum on the issue.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-0...-all-year.html
looks like the Swedes are more lucid about the situation than many Gripenfans on MP.net
http://in.*******.com/article/2012/0...80U04820120131No India jet fighter deal before end March - A.K. Antony
Re-u-t-eu-rs
One defence ministry source with knowledge of the negotiations said each Rafale was $4 million to $5 million cheaper and the plane was preferred by the Air Force.
"Unit-wise, the French plane is much cheaper than the Eurofighter. Moreover, the Indian Airforce, which is well-equipped with French fighters, is favouring the French fighter," said the source, who asked not be named.
The source added the defence ministry was considering further extending the tender to buy an additional 80 or so jets, saying bidders excluded from the current process might be permitted to take part.
would that be 126 Rafale + 80 F-35 ? ... One day maybe if they don't keep on postponing their decision
Or the IAF might be looking for lighter aircraft to cut down on the number of Tejas planned, like the Gripen. The M-MRCA was, after all, a contest to replace the aging MiG-21, a light single-engine fighter. Considering how much the Indians seem to value industrial off-sets and availability of both the aircrafts and the subsystems, I don't think the F-35 would be chosen for the IAF or the IN until it's a much safer choice.
R_Euters update 2
FromNo India jet fighter deal before end March-minister* Defence min source: Rafale jet is cheaper, preferred
R_euters, jan 31
* Lowest bid to be announced soon: sources
* Tender could be extended for 80 additional jets
NEW DELHI, Jan 31 (*******) - India will not sign a multi-billion dollar contract to buy European fighter jets before the fiscal year ends in March, the defence minister said on Tuesday, about a deal to revamp ageing weapons in line with the country's rising global influence.
"Not this financial year," Defence Minister A.K. Antony told ******* in reply to a question about when the deal that has been in the works since 2007 would be signed.
However, India will "soon" announce the lowest bidder for the tender for 126 jets worth up to $15 billion, two government sources with knowledge of the deal told *******.
One of the sources said France's Rafale jet was the likely winner, adding that the defence ministry was now considering buying another 80 or so jets and could invite bidders excluded from the current process to take part.
Already Asia's third-largest economy and growing fast, India has emerged as the world's leading importer of weapons as it jostles with China for influence and reach on the world stage.
Dassault's Rafale is competing with the Typhoon fighter made by four-nation consortium Eurofighter in what is currently one of the largest global weapons tenders.
"It is a long process. The file has not come to my table," Antony said, adding that the finance ministry and a cabinet panel headed by the prime minister have to look at the agreement after he signs off.
The Eurofighter Typhoon is built by the German and Spanish branches of EADS, Britain's BAE Systems and Italy's Finmeccanica. Dassault is French.
American, Russian and Swedish bids were rejected in April.
The U.S. company Lockheed Martin has kept alive hopes of selling its F-35 Joint Strike Fighter to India.
One defence ministry source with knowledge of the negotiations said the life-time cost of the tender including training and maintenance may reach $15 billion.
Previous estimates put the cost around $11 billion.
The defence ministry source said each Rafale was $4 million to $5 million cheaper than its rival and the plane was preferred by the Air Force.
"Unit-wise, the French plane is much cheaper than the Eurofighter. Moreover, the Indian Airforce, which is well-equipped with French fighters, is favouring the French fighter," said the source, who asked not be named.
http://www.*******.com/article/2012/...8CV3XR20120131
We should be careful with these anonymous sources...
Either its an error from the journo or the "source" is trolling
Besides didn't multiple sources report earlier that the price difference is less than 5% flyaway ?One defence ministry source with knowledge of the negotiations said the life-time cost of the tender including training and maintenance may reach $15 billion.
From:French Air Force Chief visits Qatar and Saudi Arabia
Ministere de la Defense/RafaleNews, Jan 31
The French Air Force Chief, General Palomeros was in Qatar from January 21 to 24. He met his conterpart, General Mubarak Al Kayareen as well as the Qatari armed Forces Chief, General Hamad bin Ali Al Attiyah. According to the French Ministry of Defense, the meeting was the occasion to confirm the strong relationship between the 2 Air Forces.[...]
http://www.defense.gouv.fr/air/actus...rabie-saoudite
http://rafalenews.blogspot.com/2012/...qatar-and.html
Flight simulator Rafale:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...=QMBDb8IQDVc#!
Full story:three developers had the idea to make a 3D replica of the Rafale and to offer free licenses to the followers of such programs.
To do it right, these three fans have requested authorization from Dassault Aviation. And what seemed, a priori, a formality, was not one: if, indeed, the aircraft manufacturer has no objection to this model of the Rafale to be spread, it asks, however, a fee of "several thousand euros" for the simple reason that everything that relates to the last French fighter is the subject of a "copyright".
[...]
http://www.opex360.com/2012/01/30/ra...ntellectuelle/
Rafale A ,Le Bourget museum:
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