Rafale News

[Sancho78]

That s your point of view of anti-french industry. Recently Pakistans want to replace the JF-17 chinese avionic, by french one. French are not the cheapest in the world, but they proved the quality of their technology and know how.

Guys, don't shoot the messenger!

I just explained what the issue with the Mirage upgrade and possibly with Rafale is and it's not my personal opinion, but what was reported and often said in other forums.

Sure Dassault have to change its policy about parts they used to sell at gold price. Signs show that this is changing already.

Now keep in mind that perhaps the Israeli offer was very interesting but in the end the IAF chose the Thales offer, so the Thales offer is probably better if costlier.
As for the Mig 29 upgrade, first if they changed the engine it's probably because it needed to be changed contrary to the Mirage one. Second only once both type, Mig 29 and Mirage 2000 had been upgraded, one can compare them and see what's best for the money...

I hope they change things, perhaps even with a partnership of India that could reduce the costs a lot (production of spares and weapons in India, integration of cheaper Indian weapons, Kaveri-Snecma engine possibly).
That's what I told Olybrius too, the chances of Rafale in India depend on Dassault itself, because IAF loves French fighters anyway, but politically France gov can't compete with the US, so the industrial part of the deal (ToT, offsets, partnership?) will decide Rafales faith.
EF consortium for example is pushing really hard with a lot of PR these days and they offer a partnership to India and just like Boeing they aim to transfer the production of some parts for all EFs/F18SHs to India. All that was reported from Dassault so far, is that they aim on closer ties with India and want to go "beyond a buyer - seller relationship", whatever that means.
President Sarkozy is expected in India early dec and I guess Dassault will send some high officials too, at least to sign the Mirage upgrade contract, but imo this visit will decide about Rafale too.

Regarding the upgrade, AFAIK Israel offered radar, avionics, HMS and weapons(most likely Elta 2032 radar, Python V / Derby AAMs, Dash HMS...), but couldn't do other changes on the fighter itself, to extend it's life for another 10 to 15 years. That means even if the Israeli package was more cost-effective, or even better, India had to do major parts of the upgrade with Dassault/Thales anyway.

[Olybrius]

Perhaps you guys should open a new topic if you want to continue this debate

[Olybrius]

An old article already posted about the tranche 4 order was updated with interesting infos:

France’s DGA Awards Multi-year Contract
-

[...]
In 2009, Dassault Aviation booked a single French military order worth 2.28 billion euros, company CEO Charles Edelstenne told reporters March 17, so it is easy to infer that is the value to Dassault of the 60 Rafales ordered in December.
This is not the total cost of the aircraft, however. Edelstenne noted that many of the aircraft's components and systems (engines, avionics, radar, ejection seat, etc.) are government-furnished equipment ordered from other suppliers (Snecma, Thales, etc.), an are paid separately by the customer.
The contract's value excludes value-added tax and weapons
[...]

From:
http://www.defense-aerospace.com/art...C2%A7i%3E.html

So i wonder how are paid ,for exemple, the standard Rbe2 aesa which are delivered by Thales at low rate since August, when according to the production rate of the current "PESA" Rafale [93 (total delivered end 2010) + 11 (2011) + 11 (2012) + 5 (2013) = 120] , the first tranche 4 "AESA" Rafale should be delivered in june 2013.
Currently 3 rafale are fitted with pre-production AESA radar , one "Navy" Rafale M, one "Air Force" Rafale B and another Rafale at Dassault disposal for experimentation purpose, but it was a separate order.
In any case, it could mean that Dassault is contractually and technically already able to deliver an Aesa Rafale if needed .

http://lemamouth.blogspot.com/2010/0...-de-serie.html
http://www.defensenews.com/story.php?i=4697061

[Olybrius]

New "Foxalpha" pics:




More here:
http://www.foxalpha.com/forums/viewt...8692&start=480

[xav]

The first pictures of the Agapanthe 2010 show that the typical Rafale M load for this tour is 4 GBU-12 and 2 RPL741 tanks (2x2000L), as well as 2 Mica IR. During the previous Afghanistan campaings, the Rafale M were only carrying RPL 701 tanks (1250L)

For their first mission, on November 26th, the french Rafale and Super Etendard, have watch over a british ground patrol in the south of Afghanistan, supported a medevac and been assigned to a CAS alert

Source : http://www.defense.gouv.fr/


GBU-12 in front of Rafale M19 and M20 - ©MN


Weapon specialists load GBU on Rafale M - ©MN


Rafale M19 loaded with 4xGBU-12 and 2x2000L tanks - ©MN




more: http://rafalenews.blogspot.com/2010/...es-of-cdg.html

[mas-36]

For their first mission, on November 26th, the french Rafale and Super Etendard, have watch over a british ground patrol in the south of Afghanistan, supported a medevac and been assigned to a CAS alert

This is very interesting...I wonder if the French aircraft had anything to do with the recent thread about the British battle with the talibs with over 100 talibs killed??

[Saturn]

Agapanthe presentation video clip

http://www.gouvernement.fr/gouvernem...e-presentation

[vWarWolfv]

The first pictures of the Agapanthe 2010 show that the typical Rafale M load for this tour is 4 GBU-12 and 2 RPL741 tanks (2x2000L), as well as 2 Mica IR. During the previous Afghanistan campaings, the Rafale M were only carrying RPL 701 tanks (1250L)

For their first mission, on November 26th, the french Rafale and Super Etendard, have watch over a british ground patrol in the south of Afghanistan, supported a medevac and been assigned to a CAS alert

Source : http://www.defense.gouv.fr/


GBU-12 in front of Rafale M19 and M20 - ©MN


Weapon specialists load GBU on Rafale M - ©MN


Rafale M19 loaded with 4xGBU-12 and 2x2000L tanks - ©MN




more: http://rafalenews.blogspot.com/2010/...es-of-cdg.html

No damoclès pods ?

[Sancho78]

No damoclès pods ?

Noticed that too, the SA instead seems to carry a targeting pod:





Btw, at least some good news besides the crash:

Crash of a Rafale M, the pilot is safe

The defense journalist Jean-Dominique Merchet has revealed, on his blog Secret Defense, that a Rafale M of the CdG has crashed today, 100 km off the cost of pakistan.
The Rafale would have had a problem during its transit to its patrol zone, forcing the pilot to go back to the CdG. unfortunately, he was not able to land and had to eject near the aircraft carrier. He has been picked up alive by the "Pedro" safety helicopter of the board (An Alouette III or a Dauphin). The exact cause(s) of the crash are not known yet...

http://rafalenews.blogspot.com/2010/...e-m-crash.html

[Loke2]

S/NF) BAHRAIN AIR SHOW AND NUCLEAR ENERGY: King Hamad asked General Petraeus for his help in encouraging U.S. aircraft manufacturers to participate in the inaugural Bahrain Air Show, scheduled for January 2010. He said that France was pushing the Rafale and would be there in force, although he agreed with Petraeus that the French fighter was yesterday's technology. Warming to the subject of French commercial diplomacy and referring to President Sarkozy, King Hamad said, "The UAE will give him a hard time soon," over France's proposed deal for nuclear reactors. "They're not happy with the project he's offered them."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/us-e...cuments/232927

[lapinschous1]

GBU-12 in front of Rafale M19 and M20 - ©MN

The Rafales aren't fitted with A2SM anymore?

[lapinschous1]

No damoclès pods ?

Yes it's unusual..

[JohanGrön]

Rafale crashes on operation, pilot safely ejects

France loses yet another Rafale but luckily there was no casualties this time. The Rafale was being catapulted off the Charles de Gaulle aircraft carrier more than 100 kms off the coast of Pakistan when it fell into the sea making this the first Rafale to be lost in operation (the other losses occured during training). The pilot ejected and was picked up by a rescue helicopter.

This being the fourth loss of a Rafale leaves the Charles de Gaulle with only nine Rafales left to provide air support for the troops deployed in Afghanistan.

This mission seems to be plagued by troubles...

[JohanGrön]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/us-e...cuments/232927

Here's the original document :

09MANAMA642, GENERAL PETRAEUS WITH KING HAMAD: IRAQ

[Olybrius]

don't worry boys , it will have no impact in Brazil