Firefighters ordered to be in San Fran Gay pride parade

[gaijinsamurai]

So what does me writing about double standards have to do with gays being involved in illegal activities? You still have yet to explain yourself. Perhaps it would just be easier to admit your "question" was an error, instead of digging yourself into a deeper hole. We all make mistakes when we become involved in heated debate, myself included. The adult thing to do is admit it, instead of perpetuating the bullsh*t.

So, are you saying that if I don't march in my city's annual Gay Pride parade, I don't support my gay friends?

I'm a veteran, and if a Jehova's Witness or pacifist were to object to taking part in a Veterans Day parade, I might be personally offended, but I would respect their right to decline to participate in something that might clash with their personal beliefs, or make them feel uncomfortable.

[muck]

Here in Berlin they forced dozens of officers to attend a ceremony where the gay pride flag was hoisted infront of the Berlin police departement headquarters.
Officers who secretly criticised the fuss had their eMails read and were dealt pretty hard with, including disciplinary measures and a lawsuit for libel.

Reading this story from the US now makes me wonder what sort of world we live in. Is everything done for the sake of political correctness nowadays?

[gaijinsamurai]

The only thing it and the other questions "clearly" implied was that your statement was not clear in regards to "double standards" by "politically correct liberals" (anyone that doesn't side with the Firefighters?).

What did the employers know for a fact would take place? That homo******s would be there? That on a summer day there might be shirtless men in shorts or what amounts to swimwear present and that men who share a locker room and showers would somehow take offense?

Did they know someone would expose themselves to the firefighters (if that happened)? Can any employee willingly participating in marketing and PR efforts with the public be protected from the acts of rogue individuals in the public? Police were on hand for crowd control. Is that not a reasonable effort to protect parade participants?



Do you mean you support your "best" gay friends rights, but only from a distance?

Or you just don't want to be asked to lend a hand to your employer while you are on company time to earn your wages by doing anything other than your primary job responsibilities? I get wrangled into working marketing and PR events when we are understaffed. It's legitimate company work for employees on the clock to perform.

I'm surprised you haven't chimed in on this one:

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums...d.php?t=138896

[WarriorMonk]

I thought this was old news...

if you're straight and can't stand being around gay people (unless if they're being annoying) to the point where you need to actually go and sue somebody...

are you really secure about your ******ity?

[gaijinsamurai]

^ Now, that's a valid question!

[muck]

^ Now, that's a valid question!

It is not. I'm quite sure about my (straight) ****** preferences and think its free to everyone to decide about theirs on their own. To each their own, that's for sure. Nonetheless I would not want to be forced to join one of those parades who are utterly silly by nature. Despite being hold to claim the rights of homo****** people, they usually effect the opposite and just lead to a feeling that "they" are really different from "us".

[gaijinsamurai]

Muck, sorry if I implied that everyone who is "homophobic" or feels less than comfortable around a bunch of ifeminate choreographers, hair stylists, or florists is insecure in their ******ity. It just so happens that I know a few guys who are SO homophobic (they won't even laugh at gay jokes) that it makes me wonder about them.

[Bombtrack]

At the Pride parade here there's a demo/participants from the Fire Service that are openly gay. And have a funny demo where they tap a hydrant. Or so I'm told by a few people that were there.

[muck]

Muck, sorry if I implied that everyone who is "homophobic" or feels less than comfortable around a bunch of ifeminate choreographers, hair stylists, or florists is insecure in their ******ity. It just so happens that I know a few guys who are SO homophobic (they won't even laugh at gay jokes) that it makes me wonder about them.

Fair enough, and the points I've made were totally not about homophobia anyhow. Let's "translate" it to a political level: As an avowed conservative, I would never ever join a rally of communists.
With gay pride parades, it is just the same. Of course one can join them as a hetero as well just to emphasize one's support for the rights of homo******s. If anyone is forced into them though, it is really a violation of one's basic rights in my eyes.

[Bombtrack]

Fair enough, and the points I've made were totally not about homophobia anyhow. Let's "translate" it to a political level: As an avowed conservative, I would never ever join a rally of communists.
With gay pride parades, it is just the same. Of course one can join them as a hetero as well just to emphasize one's support for the rights of homo******s. If anyone is forced into them though, it is really a violation of one's basic rights in my eyes.

Gay isnt a political group.

For instance:
http://www.google.com/search?q=gay+c...e7&rlz=1I7GGLJ

[gaijinsamurai]

I understand Muck's point, and I agree. It's all about the employer respecting your right not to participate in something which has nothing to do with your occupational duties, and is in opposition to your beliefs or creates an uncomfortable atmosphere. And yes, if an employer can ban the open display of girlie calendars and internet ****, they should not make the employees attend off-site functions which may be equally offensive.

[muck]

Gay isnt a political group.

For instance:
http://www.google.com/search?q=gay+c...e7&rlz=1I7GGLJ

I'm aware of that, although I'd state it has turned to a political lobby. It was only a comparison, gaijinsamurai perfectly pointed out what I had meant.

[Hot Lips]

So what does me writing about double standards have to do with gays being involved in illegal activities? You still have yet to explain yourself. Perhaps it would just be easier to admit your "question" was an error, instead of digging yourself into a deeper hole.

Reading 101: I did explain myself. I exlpained that your statement was, IMO, vague and was seeking clarification with a series of questions regarding what you may or may not have meant. No error in the intentions of my questions nor the explaination. I asked you to clarify what "double standards" exist - which you evade answering.

What double standards were you referring to?

So, are you saying that if I don't march in my city's annual Gay Pride parade, I don't support my gay friends?

Again, a question is not a statement. I didn't make a statement, I asked a question to seek clarification. You claim to support some of your best gay friends rights... but would seemingly be offended by being asked to work in a parade that supports your best gay friends rights even it would be done simply as a PR/Marketing representative if your company were short staffed as part of your paid employment. I find that puzzling.

[TR1]

When did I ever write that gay folks condone illegal activities?
Like I wrote earlier, I have no problem with gay pride parades. But if someone does not feel comfortable participating in one, they shouldn't have to. We all know that there happens be a lot of overt ******ity at such parades, and I don't have a problem with that, as long as everyone involved wants to be there and doesn't have a problem with it. However, if I were to show up at my office wearing a g-strig and gyrate my pelvis in front in the presence of a female co-worker, I'd be promptly disciplined, and rightly so.
If these firefighters are being forced to participate in the parade, it is therefore considered their work place, and they should have the same protection from being subjected to a hostile work evironment as anyone else.

nice..............

[Hot Lips]

I'm surprised you haven't chimed in on this one:

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums...d.php?t=138896

I'm not surprised to find that you did nor that despite supporting your very best gay friends rights, not only would you seemingly be offended to be asked to represent your employer in a parade that also supports your very best gay friends rights... as part of your paid employement.... but you are also are upset that some of your very best gay friends friends might be offended by a national advertisement that pokes fun at them.

"So it's non-PC, lighten up!" you say to your very best gay friends community.

Then why not say "so it's just a public parade full of [your] very best gay friends peers with a few having some non-PC fun on the side, lighten up" to the Firefighters?

Even if these tough men saw a stray ***** in the crowd from the distant safety of a company sponsored parade float... wouldn't they run the risk of seeing a stray ***** more frequently in the Firehouse lockeroom/shower as part of the job as well?

Are you sure these gay friends of yours are friends, let alone very best friends of yours?

Very difficult to make sense of your vague and seemingly contradictory statements.