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Thread: Sukhoi T-50 PAK FA

  1. #16
    Unicus Ac Immortalis II Dark Avenger's Avatar
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    Wasn't there some talk of a merger between SU and MiG sometime recently?

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    Senior Member Shadowstorm's Avatar
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    Not do I know of. The only thing I know MiG is working with other companies like Kazan and Kamov under the MAPO name, but they been doing that for almost a decade. However, I haven't heard anything about a meager between Sukhoi and Mikoyan.

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    Senior Member Herman the II's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Avenger View Post
    Wasn't there some talk of a merger between SU and MiG sometime recently?
    Correct, you are talking about the United Aircraft Corporation.

    The Wiki says:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_...ft_Corporation

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    Quote Originally Posted by el pablo View Post
    $1 500 000 000 debt and poor management are making me feel other way.
    They are going to be saved by government. Also look out who's the new director of "RSK MIG".........

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    Mind to tell us?

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    Senior Member Brute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MareCar View Post
    Mind to tell us?
    Mikhail Pogosyan, Sukhoi's boss.

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    So lets be less pesimistic.

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    These designs do look somewhat familiar. Can't put my finger on it. Hmmmm.....

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    Default Pak-fa


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    The distance between the drawing board and the runway is very, very, very long......

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    Default RE: Sukhoi T-50 PAK FA

    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Avenger View Post
    Wasn't there some talk of a merger between SU and MiG sometime recently?
    The effort to have the two companies merge came from international investors who had been investing since the concept of a competitor to the new America aircraft.
    The longer the program dragged out the less chance they see any profit for their investment. I got the following piece from Flight International Magazine -12/05;
    "United Bank -Moscow, a venture capital bank in a report feels that MiG and
    Suhkoi need to join together in order to remain competitive in the world
    market.
    It is international investors that have kept these two companies afloat over the last fifteen years. It is banks like this that recommend yes or no to these investors about where to place their money. Banks like this is where companies like these go when they need large amount of money. So people listen to these reports."

    Adrian

  12. #27
    Federov Avtomat, FTW!
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    Hope Mig survives. With the SMT mig-29s from the cancelled Algerian contract the Russian AF might decide to upgrade a few more Migs to match. The Upgrade of the Mig-29 and the Mig-31 within the RuAF was going incredibly slowly otherwise. The Two upgraded Mig-31s have been at the centre to develop manuals and tactics for an age.

    For a while they had a management that focused on civilian contracts... keep in mind the the original MiG company hasn't existed for quite some time. Modern day design bureaus can't survive on their own because they make no revenue. That is why MiG became MIG (something Industrial Group) that included the MiG design bureau but also some factories and other companies as well. Then it added MIG-MAPO which I believe added other concerns like Kamov and other companies. Now there is OAK which consolidates most of the old aircraft industries together.

    These designs do look somewhat familiar. Can't put my finger on it. Hmmmm.....
    Possibly two main things that make these designs familiar. First is the laws of physics. The second is a lack of real information that makes people draw variations of known aircraft, both Russian prototypes and known 5th gen fighters (ie F-22 and F-35).
    Reminds me of the early 80s when the scary T-80 was known about but no photos had been released yet. In Reagans propaganda manual, Soviet Military Power, the T-80 was revealed to be an M1 Abrams with Red Stars all over it. The Tunguska was depicted as Gepard.

    The distance between the drawing board and the runway is very, very, very long......
    Except the PAK-FA left the drawing board and the design was sent to the factory to make prototypes just over a year and a half ago. Manufacturing flying prototypes doesn't take long at all... that is why they are used.

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    "United Bank -Moscow, a venture capital bank in a report feels that MiG and
    Suhkoi need to join together in order to remain competitive in the world
    market.
    I disagree.

    There are plenty of companies in Russia that design aircraft of some form or another, from Mil and Kamov, through to Yakovlev and Mig and Sukhoi and Illyusion, Tupolev, Myasechev (spelling) etc etc, plus quite a few more that no one has heard of. I think there is room for two Russian aircraft companies... if just to prevent a C-17 type situation. Despite western opinion there has always been competition in Soviet and Russian military development. The problem has always been political power can outweigh a good design advantage and currently Sukhoi seems to weild the big stick in that regard. The point is that consolidating into two companies should give both a large enough income stream to remain viable.

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    Senior Member Shadowstorm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GazB View Post
    Hope Mig survives. With the SMT mig-29s from the cancelled Algerian contract the Russian AF might decide to upgrade a few more Migs to match. The Upgrade of the Mig-29 and the Mig-31 within the RuAF was going incredibly slowly otherwise. The Two upgraded Mig-31s have been at the centre to develop manuals and tactics for an age.

    For a while they had a management that focused on civilian contracts... keep in mind the the original MiG company hasn't existed for quite some time. Modern day design bureaus can't survive on their own because they make no revenue. That is why MiG became MIG (something Industrial Group) that included the MiG design bureau but also some factories and other companies as well. Then it added MIG-MAPO which I believe added other concerns like Kamov and other companies. Now there is OAK which consolidates most of the old aircraft industries together.
    Very true GazB, Mikoyan seems like it went downhill in the last few years. The MiG-AT advanced trainer lost out to the Yak-130 for Russian Air Force new requirement for a next-generation advanced trainer and also the MiG-AT isn't doing well on the export market with Algeria and possibility Egypt along with a few other countries looking to get the Yak-130 instead. The same with MFI competition with Sukhoi, the MiG-1-42/44 had some advantages over the Sukhoi S-37 (Su-47), but it was the political and budget problems along with Sukhoi win during the competition what killed the MiG-1-42/44. Also Mikoyan offered the plane to the Indian Air Force which was interested for a new fifth-generation fighter and the IAF was interested in the MiG-1-42/44 and it seems like Mikoyan was about to get the contract, but Sukhoi offer the Su-47 which could do same thing like the MiG-1-42/44 at a cheaper price and later the deal went to Sukhoi for development for India new fifth-generation fighter along with HAL. The MiG-29 is a different story because most of the MiG-29's the nations are getting were used versions with upgraded systems while the Indian Navy got brand new MiG-29K/KUB's. So I hope Mikoyan gets their act together because I would hate to see a company that made the famous MiG-15 and MiG-21 go down the drain.

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