Sukhoi T-50 PAK FA

[headman]

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but regardless, technically the fastest interceptor was the YF-12, although it never went into production. It was very successful, though. But that and the MiG-31 are off-topic.

Russia can build an aircraft that is superior to the F-22. But it wouldn't be mass-produced, and so it would not have any effect on the F-22 at all. Likewise, the US could build an aircraft that is much better than the F-22. But it would be in such small numbers that it would be pointless.

So , you know where are you here ? it's PAK FA's topic , not F22 topic's .
Originally Posted by metberkut
UHM, how about a no? The more things change, the more they stand the same.
Norway have one foot in F-35 program (imho, a foot in sh!t.), and it is way way too late to pull out. There is bigger chance that Headman will make any sense, than Norway buying PAK-FA. Btw, could people just ignore Headman?

you don't read my post before , it's ridiculous , change you glasses !!
I talks about norway on previous post , pak fa is impossible, because norway in NATO american defense. End debate

[kontempladorII]

look this photo , it's a blocker anti radar waves.
the problem is solved.

That picture was already discussed here some pages back. It is believed to be a photoshop of the original one. Someone just pasted an official photo of the engine manufacturer on the controversial T-50 photo displaying the engine blades.

[kontempladorII]

S-duct is only one solution out of several possibilities when it comes to stealth... there's been talk of using plasma stealth but not in a way that has been most widely discussed -- that is covering the whole plane surface which is actually counterproductive... it seems the plasma stealth is going to be applied in limited areas where it's most important -- like the engine intake -- where it can be used as a radar blocker by introducing a cone shaped plasma field that would then dissipate inbound radar signals... the amount of energy required to generate such a field is small enough for the generator to be hard/impossible to detect... a device for this has been tested in 2004 and the technology is supposedly readily available to the Russians....

That's interesting. Perhaps, I'm one of the few who believes on "plasma stealth". So, instead of covering the whole airplane and 'burning' the electronics they will (try to) confine the plasma inside the intakes. If it is achievable, it will be fantastic.

[LS1 Miata]

So , you know where are you here ? it's PAK FA's topic , not F22 topic's

You mentioned the MiG-31 first...not me. I simply corrected you on your post.

[kontempladorII]

There will be some form of radar blocker on the PAKFA, currently not installed probably because its the first flying prototype. The YF-32 from Boeing was supposed to be stealthier than the F-35 from Lockheed, but didnt use an S-duct and just had a radar blocker, so that alone doesnt condemn the PAKFA in any way.

Yes, but X-32 wasn't supposed to be a 'high performance fighter' like the F-22 or PakFa.

[kontempladorII]

Here's the key word..."nearly". The F-22 doesn't have EO/DAS, AIM-9X, and a 360 degree off-bore capability. In fact, no other aircraft in the world has this.

What do you mean with 360 degree off-bore capability? It's perhaps a small issue and I don't want to be picky, but '360 degrees' means that it can only fire in a plane, if the planes are not aligned this capability would be of little use. What is actually the fraction of the sky covered by that capability (if it's known), in terms of square degrees, etc.

[headman]

You mentioned the MiG-31 first...not me. I simply corrected you on your post.

Your reaction don't surprise me.
When i make a technical analysis of the pak fa , everytime a guy talking about the F22 is supposedly unbeatable and better , bla-bla-bla.....
It reminds me the history of SR71 blackbird, which was supposedly unbeatable, until such time as the MIG 31 sniffs her buttocks and sends it to retirement by USAF, sorry fanboy F22 .

[skyisland]

Your reaction don't surprise me.
When i make a technical analysis of the pak fa , everytime a guy talking about the F22 is supposedly unbeatable and better , bla-bla-bla.....
It reminds me the history of SR71 blackbird, which was supposedly unbeatable, until such time as the MIG 31 sniffs her buttocks and sends it to retirement by USAF, sorry fanboy F22 .

I don't think a fanboy can accuse someone else of being a 'fanboy' headman..

I've read a lot of post on this thread and a lot a people on here are 'fanboys' of the PAK-FA if you didn't notice the hundreds of post of "this jet is better than the F-22" with no facts to support such outrageous claims.

F-22 has already proven its a jet that no other jet in service can match. I mean a 150 million dollar jet should be a 70 million dollar PAK-FA right? And seeing how the F-22 has no flaws in any area I think comparing a untested less stealthy PAK-FA to the F-22 to be ignorant in itself..

[LS1 Miata]

What do you mean with 360 degree off-bore capability? It's perhaps a small issue and I don't want to be picky, but '360 degrees' means that it can only fire in a plane, if the planes are not aligned this capability would be of little use. What is actually the fraction of the sky covered by that capability (if it's known), in terms of square degrees, etc.

The F-35 will have the capability of firing an AIM-9X without having to maneuver in a merge. That gives it a first-shot kill opportunity, and with today's WVR missile's it's basically a guaranteed hit (most of the time). No other aircraft (not the F-22, and probably not the PAK-FA) can do this.

[Orocairion]

You seriously like to drink Lockheed's kool-aid when it comes to the F-35, don't you?.

[LS1 Miata]

You seriously like to drink Lockheed's kool-aid when it comes to the F-35, don't you?.

The only problem with this is that EO/DAS has already gone through extensive testing. That's one part of the program that's actually AHEAD of schedule.

[artjomh]

The F-35 will have the capability of firing an AIM-9X without having to maneuver in a merge. That gives it a first-shot kill opportunity, and with today's WVR missile's it's basically a guaranteed hit (most of the time). No other aircraft (not the F-22, and probably not the PAK-FA) can do this.

If you are getting within Sidewinder's range with a VLO airplane, you are doing it wrong in the first place.

I mean, come one, these aircraft are not meant to dogfight as their primary combat profile. The very reason why F-22 has only two Sidewinders is because these are self-defense weapons in case the original mission fails and it was FORCED within visual range.

AIM-120D and RVV-AE is where its at.

The only problem with this is that EO/DAS has already gone through extensive testing. That's one part of the program that's actually AHEAD of schedule.

Oh, great. NG and LM invented the IRST! Yippee.

Anyway, why are we discussing F-35 in a PAK-FA thread?

[Breakfast in Vegas]

If you are getting within Sidewinder's range with a VLO airplane, you are doing it wrong in the first place.

I mean, come one, these aircraft are not meant to dogfight as their primary combat profile. The very reason why F-22 has only two Sidewinders is because these are self-defense weapons in case the original mission fails and it was FORCED within visual range.

AIM-120D and RVV-AE is where its at.

Probably true, however obviously not everybody in Sukhoi/RuAF thinks so... or why put so much effort in maintaining full maneuverability in PAK-FA at (most probably) the cost of some stealth?

The Phantom lesson of Vietnam is another case in point that dogfighting skills are still vital, even if that lesson is 40 years old.

Things can change, and with these aircraft looking at 20-30 year lifespans, they probably will.

[LS1 Miata]

If you are getting within Sidewinder's range with a VLO airplane, you are doing it wrong in the first place.

I mean, come one, these aircraft are not meant to dogfight as their primary combat profile. The very reason why F-22 has only two Sidewinders is because these are self-defense weapons in case the original mission fails and it was FORCED within visual range.

AIM-120D and RVV-AE is where its at.

I can agree with that, but I can also agree with LM incorporating technology which puts the F-35 above all "just in case". Let's be honest. The F-35 is not nearly as maneuverable as the F-22, PAK-FA, or other European aircraft. So any advantage that can be used is a pretty smart thing to do, because you never know when you're going to need it.

Oh, great. NG and LM invented the IRST! Yippee.

Never said that they did, but what they did do is take it to a whole new level.

Anyways, to further prove my point, here's an AIM-9X doing a near 180 degree turn without EO/DAS.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4g4_jzqBJnA

So this talk of "drinking LM koolade", implying that they're lying, is fallacious.

[Sancho78]

Here's the key word..."nearly". The F-22 doesn't have EO/DAS, AIM-9X, and a 360 degree off-bore capability. In fact, no other aircraft in the world has this. Believe it or not, the F-35 is going to be a better dogfighter than any aircraft in the world (assuming the PAK-FA doesn't have a similar system to EO/DAS and a 360 degree off-bore missile capability).

Really? The Rafale offers similar capabilities with FSO, NG DDM and Spectra isn't it? ETOS and DAS are not totally new techs, these are already available in targeting pods, IRST, or other IR systems. LM just integrated all of them, to have no external pods and a lower RCS.