Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

[SuperCarrierFan]

jdam1, I think you are right, the article ( as so much in the press ) is reading something into the facts that is not there. The QE is to all intents and purposes finished from a design point of view. The PoW needs that basic design altered to be able to operate F35C, this is MUCH more complicated than many people think. Apart from the launch rails, blast deflectors ( including water cooling ), arrester gear and the power requiremants to operate all of that there is the launch control psoition. This was shown most effectively in CJ's link to the TRUMAN, especially how it is raised and lowered ! I think it is not only the procurement of the hardware ( underway ) but also the software to go with it AND the operating procedures which is why we have so many RN personnel seconded to the US.

[CarrierFan2006]

Hello all... Hope you had a good Christmas / New Year.

Been away a while, and I have not had much chance to post on here. Frankly I've not wanted to after some of the replies to my comments in relation to immigration, which I found distasteful and in some cases plain nasty. Thanks to those of you who added supportive messages after the rather off topic and unnecessary jibes from a few people here who clearly subscribe to the EDL view of the world.

I would like to point out that I am not PC. That implies having no sense of humour, which I do, and having a broom handle up my a*se, which I don't. I am, however, a realist. I absolutely agree that waste immigration needs to be stopped - and by that I mean spongers and wasters coming to the UK to cream money from the welfare system for no return to the country. Indeed, I personally saw to it yesterday, in fact, that one such person will be removed from the UK after he's done time. However, this is, and always has been, a nation of fairness, and if there are dullards who think that we are building these carriers to defend some sort of "White English" paradise, then they should think again. We have not spent the past 400 years as the world's foremost naval power, crushing Slavery, Napoleon, Hitler, Mussolini, Gadaffi, Saddam, Bin Laden, and many other evil, sick people who view the world through closed, hateful, spiteful eyes, to have more such morons spouting off here. The ideals to which such people subscribe lead, inevitably, to hatred and totalitarianism, fear and repression, something totally at odds with the way this nation has always been run, and totally alien to right thinking people in this nation.

Thank you. I will now climb, carefully, off my high horse, before it falls over.

[Naval Oldie]

That aol article seems very strange we are already building the carriers, the French paid us and thales UK for the Intellectual Property of the CVF why would we now be going to America for carrier designs?

All I can think of is that they are talking about emails design and integration

I do not think we should read much into the headline as there is nothing sinister in the body of the article. The fact is that after a 40 year gap of operating strike carriers we are looking for help in rebuilding that capability. This includes not only the hardware in the carrier but also personnel training and operating procedures. As far as the F35C is concerned. Were there to be any problems with this programme, I would prefer it if we purchased a couple of squadrons of F18s which could be replaced by the last batch of F35s in the 2030s. This would enable the carrier(s) to get up to speed more quickly particularly as aircrew could be trained up to operate them from USN carriers in the next few years. However, I suspect this will not happen as the bean counters would be happy if delays in the F35C programme enabled money to be saved even if at the expense of capability.

It would be nice if the announcement concerning the carriers that is expected later this year clearly articulated the plan for the conversion of both ships to full fixed wing capability. Naturally there would be economies of scale if two carrier sets of equipment were purchased at the same time within the same contracts but I suspect the short-term view will be taken with PoW being built to full fixed wing capability and QE paying off into reserve once PoW is built. Any announcement about QE's conversion will no doubt be delayed until the 2015 SDSR. If approved, QE could be converted in time to replace PoW when she is due for her first refit in the mid 2020's.

[jonas]

That aol article seems very strange we are already building the carriers, the French paid us and thales UK for the Intellectual Property of the CVF why would we now be going to America for carrier designs?

All I can think of is that they are talking about emails design and integration

Having read through the article again I doubt whether it was about the design and integration of EMALS,but something a little more of a political nature. Look at the following extract :-

"Cevasco says that the UK "understands the challenge associated with working cooperation in parallel with both the US and France. Some of what the US provides can certainly be shared with the UK and France, but I suspect some of what the US shares with the UK will be shared subject to the understanding it not be transferred further. The UK has operated in that dual mode for decades--separating its transatlantic cooperation and its intra-Europe cooperation."

I would suggest that the US wishes guarantees that its transfer of technology for this system to the UK,is for the UK only and not to be shared with any other ally at this moment in time..

I wonder if Hammand brought up the subject of the software codes for the F35C during these discussions,it has never been yet divulged if we have been able to gain access to them so that we can update them in the UK if we need to.
Either LM or some US Governmental dept have been very loath to release them,which means any update can only be done by or in the US. This would somewhat restrict our ability to make full use of the aircrafts capabilities in the future without US permission.

Every time a question has been asked of the MOD or Defence Secretary about this ,we have been fobbed of with the same old 'We are satisfied with the situation'.

IMO there are two scenario's here, one is that we have not yet succeeded in gaining access to the codes. The other is that we have managed to gain access to them,but the US does not wish anyone to know as this would cause other customer countries to demand the same.

Just my take on things.

[cockneyjock1974]

Hi all,

I saw a 4th sponson the other day for a brief period of time, in the sense that it was visible next to the other 3 and when I looked about an hour later it was gone.

What I will say is that it was absoloutely huge and it had the extra bit on it that I think will house the mechanism for the elevators. So i'm guessing that the next sponson will be on the starboard side, which suits me because I can photgraph the b**dy thing lol.

I know you all know this but its hard to think that when the next two sponsons go on, centre block 03 will be structually complete, its come along way so quickly.

With regards to the Aol article, IMO we are asking for help from the US to either refit the QE with an angled deck and refig to a catapult design. or we just do not simply know how to config POW to a cats and traps set up. I think though its highly unlikely that our naval architects do not know how to design a US style CV so i'm hoping the former is more likely.

F18's? If the the economy is on the mend, I think it's highly probable that we will lease/buy a handful of them for training here, it wouldn't take much to set up an arrestor wire at Culdrose, because at the end of the day as any US pilot will tell you its the "trapping" thats the hard part. Also its much more economic which will please the abacus flickers.

[jonas]

cockneyjock1974,
"With regards to the Aol article, IMO we are asking for help from the US to either refit the QE with an angled deck and refig to a catapult design. or we just do not simply know how to config POW to a cats and traps set up. I think though its highly unlikely that our naval architects do not know how to design a US style CV so i'm hoping the former is more likely."

As I said,I doubt very much if it is either of the above but something more political and of a more serious nature.
The design work for the QE with angled deck is already done,and as far as EMALS is concerned it is certain that a team from the US will be onhand in the UK when it is fitted. This is normal practice for any company selling equipment like this abroad,the makers will want to ensure things are done correctly and that it works to spec.

As far as F18's are concerned,I hate to sound contradictory but IMO it think it highly unlikely that we will get them and personaly I wouldn't want us to.

I see no reason for a set up as you suggest on land,our exchange pilots are doing what they need to do and that is landing on a ship at sea. This is worlds away from doing it on land.

In the case that F35C is delayed for any reason the US would not be in a position to lease us any aircraft,as they would need every F18 airframe they could get there hands on to tide them over.

Buying any would not be more economic at all, we are committed to F35C so when they become available do you get rid of the F18's at a loss or do you carry on flying them as we couldn't afford both.

As long as we have fast jet pilots embedded with the USN and MN we are OK, and we are not that desperate yet that we need to be talking of buying F18's

Everyone and their dog are having a go at the F35 programme,the point is that if it was to go '**** up' it would cripple LM and the US Government is not going to let that happen.

No,we will see this aircraft in service on RN carriers and not a 20yr old design that is F18.

Sorry if my post sounds a bit bullish,but this subject is starting to be somewhat of a hot potatoe.

[Jdam1]

Hi all,

I saw a 4th sponson the other day for a brief period of time, in the sense that it was visible next to the other 3 and when I looked about an hour later it was gone.

What I will say is that it was absoloutely huge and it had the extra bit on it that I think will house the mechanism for the elevators. So i'm guessing that the next sponson will be on the starboard side, which suits me because I can photgraph the b**dy thing lol.

I know you all know this but its hard to think that when the next two sponsons go on, centre block 03 will be structually complete, its come along way so quickly.

It is a little bit scary how fast she is coming together, all these years of talking and now it finally coming together, that said those sponsons are really bare they have a lot of work to do before LB02 arrives in summer.

As for the F-18, it simple wouldn’t make sense for us to get some, any time the F-35 is delayed is time the navy will spend training for its arrival, any money spent on F-18s would just be money wasted.

[danim]

double post

[danim]

Although a Royal Navy F-18 looks really nice

Royal Navy F-18 by danim007, on Flickr

[danim]

as does a Royal Navy E2C

Royal Navy E2C Hawkeye by danim007, on Flickr

[jonodavies12]

What about a RN V-22?

[danim]

unfortunately that is one I can't do as it is not been built yet for the game I play but I have done a

Westland Wessex

Westland Wessex SAR in VSF by danim007, on Flickr

and a Phantom


and am working on a RN version of the SH-60 Seahawk

[SDL]

This is probably a Q for the British Military thread, but has the MOD ever looked into getting a few of them?

[Jdam1]

SDL I don't know if you are talking about the F-18 or E2 but both wouldn't have been given much thought if it was assumed we were going for a STOVL carrier

[jonas]

unfortunately that is one I can't do as it is not been built yet for the game I play but I have done a

Westland Wessex

Westland Wessex SAR in VSF by danim007, on Flickr

and a Buccaner


and am working on a RN version of the SH-60 Seahawk

That Buccaner as you put it happens to be a Phantom.
and a Buccaner