New Frigates for the Royal Navy - Type 26

[Pongoglo]

As a matter of interest to other users,the above link seems to have a virus attached to it.

Agreed - apparently the Exploit Phoenix Exploit Kit (Type 769) - blocked by AVG. Sounds nasty! To return to SSM's, how about a surface launched variant of this? MBDA seem to know what their doing, and the UK have a big interest in the firm, could also be a solution as regards surface strike, UK JCA and the QE class? Anyone know anything about the missile? New one on me..

[Liger30]

Anyone know anything about the missile? New one on me..

To put it simply, the Marte missile is the italian answer to the Sea Skua. Is launched by italian navy helicopters, AW101 Merlin included. The ER version is longer range and modified for use from airplanes, and has been offered for integration on Typhoon, mainly targeted to India which wanted an anti-ship missile in the package.
The FASGW(H) or Sea Skua II in development is about as ambitious.

When you think that Rafale offers Exocet, you start to understand why Typhoon lost in India...

[Eoin666]

This plus reduced budget may force them to lean towards MM40 Blk III ? It is MBDA after all...

i wouldn't be surprised at the MM40 either, although I wouldn't be surprised at the NSM after it's integrated on the F-35 or even both.....As a maritime nation to be without MPA's and no dedicated long range anti shipping weapons is beyond ridiculous

[Corrupt]

i wouldn't be surprised at the MM40 either, although I wouldn't be surprised at the NSM after it's integrated on the F-35 or even both.....As a maritime nation to be without MPA's and no dedicated long range anti shipping weapons is beyond ridiculous

And yet incredibly likely

[Genotype]

Perhaps the Royal Navy will join in the LRASM program?

http://defense-update.com/features/2...010_lrasm.html

MBDA have a weapon project intended for the role, but it's still largely at the concept stage.

http://home.janes.com/events/exhibit...sile-of-.shtml

[Ought Six]

MBDA have a weapon project intended for the role, but it's still largely at the concept stage.

http://home.janes.com/events/exhibit...sile-of-.shtml

"Fielded in 15-20 years"?

[Genotype]

"Fielded in 15-20 years"?

Yeah, it's a very long way off compared to an in-service of 2015(?) for LRASM.

If type 26 is intended to enter service by 2021, I wouldn't be surprised if alternate weapons are pursued instead for timescale purposes...and I wouldn't be surprised if cost is a major reason too. LRASM's ability to be fired from a VLS would immediately put it as the leading candidate, considering that Perseus's development was spurred by lack of available weapons fireable from a VLS (Type 26 will rely heavily on Sylver).

On paper (and yes I know, it only exists on paper) Perseus looks like it would be an extremely capable weapon compared to a subsonic LRASM-A development though. But as I said, in the current climate I'm sceptical about it eventually materialising into a real weapon fielded by the Royal Navy.

Gabriel's page has previously explained this far better than I can.

In the longer term, Harpoon will need a replacement, and the Type 26 frigate will of course need a weapon system other than the CAMM missile for point air defence. The same article on "Rivista Italiana Difesa" drops in a couple of hints about this as well, and confirms the analysis done on this blog on the latest imagery of the Type 26 concept released by BAE in a January 2012 video: the Type 26 main armament will be carried in a silo counting 24 cells. It is not specified which VLS system will be fitted, but it'll possibly be the Sylver A70. The 24 cells are reportedly going to be used for a modular missile or a family of as common and closely related as possible missiles acting as Harpoon replacement, which is, according to the italian magazine's sources, required to cover three roles:
- Anti Ship
- Land Attack
- Anti submarine

The requirement is still very much flexible and without a well defined shape. Currently, Vertical launch anti-ship missiles aren't exactly around to start with: a VLS Harpoon has been on the cards for years, but never progressed. In addition, there is not an existing missile on the market which is
capable of covering all three roles.

............

With the first Type 26 expected in service by 2021, it is time to start some serious activity, as only a new design can met all three roles and meet the VL requirement. Little is known of the performances desired from the missile, but a minimum effective range of 200 km has been indicated. The UK and France have begun funding studies by missile maker MBDA for a future cruise missile, potentially for employment from ships and airplanes alike (the latter as a possible longer-term Storm Shadow replacement).

The first results of the studies are visible in the concept "Perseus" that MBDA first showed last year. This missile is roughly 5 meters long (more or less like Storm Shadow) and is said to weight 800 kg (down from 1300 of Storm Shadow) with a range of 300 km or more, the ability to strike ship and land targets with different attack profiles, high speed (more than Mach 3 in certain profiles) and modular space for different warheads to increase mission flexibility. Some 200 kg would be available for the warhead according to MBDA, and they have shown a notional "triple" warhead which features 100 kg of explosive in the missile, along with 2x 50 kg "effectors" that are dropped by the missile in the last stretch of the attack course, to hit either multiple targets in the same area, or to strike a single large target (like a major warship) in several different areas at once for maximum lethality.

Other warhead options would include bunker-buster payloads and others, and if it was possible to use elements of the booster for firing a StingRay torpedo, a Perseus-derived family of missiles could be the answer for SSGW. Importantly, the Perseus is shown by MBDA being launched by VLS cells (as well as from a submarine's torpedo tubes), almost certainly Sylver A70 (the shorter A50 cell, used for example on Type 45, is five meters deep, and Perseus is unlikely to fit in with the vertical launch booster).

http://ukarmedforcescommentary.blogs...-missiles.html

i wouldn't be surprised at the MM40 either, although I wouldn't be surprised at the NSM after it's integrated on the F-35 or even both.....As a maritime nation to be without MPA's and no dedicated long range anti shipping weapons is beyond ridiculous

Am I right in thinking that the JSM will fit in the weapon bays of the F35B?

If it does, then I can't think of a single good reason why the UK shouldn't purchase JSM, considering someone else is already willing to pay for integration with the F35.

It has extremely advanced features, it'll be available off the shelf, it'll require no integration time/cost and it'll provide anti-ship and land strike abilities to the F35s without compromising LO operations. What's not to like there?

[xav]

[jonas]

Perseus,another concept that we won't see until years in the future (if ever).

This however is a missile for the littorals,that is definately needed in todays maritime climate and small enough to be a plug in system able to be swapped such as Phallanx is.

Farnborough 2012: MBDA completes Sea Spear live firing

10 July 2012 - 10:07 by Beth Stevenson in Farnborough
MBDA has recently completed live firing trials of its new Brimstone Sea Spear missile system for anti-FIAC (fast inshore attack craft) applications.
The system is designed to engage targets that generally operate in 'swarms' of some 40 boats, and is launched from a surface platform to pinpoint small fast moving targets.

'We've been looking at this anti-FIAC capability and conducted trials earlier this year at Parc Aberporth,' Frank Morgan, technical and military operations executive told a media briefing at the Farnborough International Airshow on 10 July. 'In March this year we conducted a data gathering trial.

'That was followed- because we were so successful in that- with us conducting a live firing two weeks ago. It hit in the engine area taking out the target.'

He said the company was 'very pleased' with the results of the trial, and identified that it wants to move to a more navalised application for the Brimstone.

'We use data from the radar or any EO/IR system on the vessel and fuse that data together to gain the location of the target,' Morgan continued. 'It's a one-button push with many missiles engaging the target.'

The missile is based around the Brimstone Dual-Mode configuration, which combines a millimetric wave seeker and semi-active laser.

'In using a dual mode system you're tracking this target autonomously,' Morgan continued. 'For dual-mode Brimstone you anoint the target so the missile knows where it's going and at some point the missile takes over into millimetric wave tracking mode.'

Morgan said that following operations in Libya and Afghanistan the Brimstone has proved itself to be the 'weapon of choice', and the naval configuration has been based around 'robust but simple' operating technology.

It has an all-weather radar system, autonomous fire and forget capability, and is based on a modular design so that it can be moved from one vessel to another.

'Our system is reasonably mature with the testing that it's done. We're in the process of developing that system in its wholeness,' Morgan explained.

He said a development date has not yet been set, but 'it's a number of months' and not years until MBDA will be able to offer a viable system. The company also confirmed that it has received 'substantial support' from the UK MoD throughout the programme.

MBDA said the surface launched system, as well as a fast jet launched system, are the 'most immediate markets' for the Brimstone Sea Spear, and therefore it is concentrating on developing these configurations first before exploring other launch platforms such as helicopters.

NB:- Thanks to Shephardmedia.com

[jonas]

Sorry double post

[xav]

Speaking of Marte... and MBDA still

Airbus Military C295 MPA carries MBDA MARTE MK2/S Anti-ship Missile for first time

Airbus Military and MBDA have successfully completed the first flight of the C295 maritime patrol aircraft with an instrumented Marte MK2/S anti-ship inert missile installed under the wing. The flight was the first of a series of trials planned in a joint Airbus Military – MBDA collaboration to validate the aerodynamic integration of Marte on the C295. Subsequent flights will include handling qualities testsand aircraft flight performance tests.

This initiative successfully aligns with the Defence industry strategy shared by MBDA in Spain and Airbus Military.

http://www.navyrecognition.com/index...sk=view&id=498

[Eoin666]

Am I right in thinking that the JSM will fit in the weapon bays of the F35B?

If it does, then I can't think of a single good reason why the UK shouldn't purchase JSM, considering someone else is already willing to pay for integration with the F35.

It has extremely advanced features, it'll be available off the shelf, it'll require no integration time/cost and it'll provide anti-ship and land strike abilities to the F35s without compromising LO operations. What's not to like there?

Sssshhhh don't mention the B. The Norgies and LM are integrating on the A although that ought to qualify for the C also. But we could yet have a stealthy aircraft with a stealthy missile hung off a significantly less stealthy pylon!

[Liger30]

Parliamentary answers 21 June:-

Defence: Procurement

John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence pursuant to the written ministerial statement of 22 February 2012, Official Report, column 77WS, on the Royal Fleet Auxiliary, what recent assessment he has made of the proportion of the Royal Navy's budget that will be used to fund the procurement of (a) versatile Type 26 frigates and (b) successor submarines; and how many vessels he expects to be procured in each case. [R] [109632]

Peter Luff: Procurement of new equipment projects, including the Type 26 frigate and the successor deterrent, is funded from the equipment procurement plan, which is held and managed centrally. As such, none of Navy Command's budget will be used to fund those projects.

The Ministry of Defence's (MOD) current planning assumption is for the construction of 13 Type 26 Global Combat Ships (GCS). The Type 26 GCS programme is currently in its assessment phase, with the results of this phase expected by the middle of this decade.

A MOD document puts the Surface Ships budget share of the famous 160 billions 10-year budget at 18 billion pounds. Included in it there is some funding for initial work on the next phase of MARS (the Solid Replenishers), completition of CVF and Type 45 and of course Type 26.

As for Sea Ceptor on Type 23, 2016 has long been the intended date. MBDA has shown already for some time how the Sea Ceptor will fit into the 23s... what still misses is a bit of detail about the refits plan: it'll take quite some work to replace the missile system if they go with the MBDA-shown solution. Would be nice to know how they get the various ships refitted.

[Andy-M]

latest design released for the Type 26

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-19312378

[SDL]

Looks good... this is a 'latest' design or a 'final' design