New Frigates for the Royal Navy - Type 26

[Andy-M]

Happy Slapper,

Do you think the Sampson Radar from the Type 45 will be considered as a stand alone radar on this new frigate? I remember reading on Beedall a few years back that they were considering doing this.

[happyslapper]

I believe 32 is the target number of escorts, and has been ever since the 1998 SDR. The fact that the government, through appalling management of the military, have allowed it to slip to around 16, is a fvcking disgrace. Don't judge by the current numbers.

Up until last week, the number of C1/Type 26 I had repeatedly heard was 12 (or rather, ''don't hope for more than 12''). So 10 is reasonable. Bear in mind that this is essentially a new capability, which will replace both the Type 42s (that the Type 45 hasn't due to numbers), and the Type 22s, with something very different. So we're replaceing 12+4 with 6+10. The Type 23's will effectively fill the C2 role until the new ships (C2/Type 27) start replaceing them as they decommission (we're talking mid-2020's at this point). It also gives you some idea of the size and capability if you think of them in terms of a roughly 1-for-1 (plus 3, as per current plans) replacement of the type 23. When you consider the 23's are being upgraded with CAMM, Artisan radar, 2087 sonar, etc... we're talking about a very capable replacement.
The C3 is the one that is a bit iffy in my mind, it's going to be one heck of a challenge trying to fit all those different capabilities of the OPVs/MCMs/Hydrographics etc on a single hull, even if it is modular.

At least now the RN is being given what it needs to both modernise and get the numbers up. And it only took an election to get the politicians to support...!

[happyslapper]

Happy Slapper,

Do you think the Sampson Radar from the Type 45 will be considered as a stand alone radar on this new frigate? I remember reading on Beedall a few years back that they were considering doing this.

http://www.science.mod.uk/Codex/Issue2/News/news5.aspx

The Artisan 3D radar is going to be the standard radar of the RN for the next generation. It's basically a scaled down version of Sampson, with all the lessons learned (hence the Type 45's price was always worth it). It's going to be on the LPDs, the QE carriers, the upgraded T23s, and the new C1 and C2 frigates.

[Holmes85]

Thanks for keeping us updated Happyslapper. I enjoyed reading the articles.

[Andy-M]

http://www.science.mod.uk/Codex/Issue2/News/news5.aspx

The Artisan 3D radar is going to be the standard radar of the RN for the next generation. It's basically a scaled down version of Sampson, with all the lessons learned (hence the Type 45's price was always worth it). It's going to be on the LPDs, the QE carriers, the upgraded T23s, and the new C1 and C2 frigates.

Thanks for that, with regards to the below quote

The C3 is the one that is a bit iffy in my mind, it's going to be one heck of a challenge trying to fit all those different capabilities of the OPVs/MCMs/Hydrographics etc on a single hull, even if it is modular.

how about the BMT Venator design?

http://www.bmtdsl.co.uk/?/196/853/1708

[happyslapper]

how about the BMT Venator design?

http://www.bmtdsl.co.uk/?/196/853/1708

Yep, that's directly tailored towards the C3 requirement, as it stood around 2007 (and roughly as it stands now). As a minor wafighter it's ok (it would be interesting to see how they're going to give it a low magnetic signature for minehunting), but as a hydrographic/support vessel, i'm not convinced. This is the one time when I agree with the Absalon fanboys about fitting a flex deck - it's going to be these ships which will be forward based in the Carribbean etc, where a flex deck would be extremely useful for humanitarian missions and supporting local garrisons.
Now that it's all hotting up, I expect other shipbuilders will start making serious bids for the C3 too. We could see some really exciting innovative designs being submitted over the next couple of years.
Personally I suspect they might split it into a couple of classes rather than creating a jack of all trades, master of none.

[Holmes85]

That's butt ugly..

I'm sorry, but I can't resist.

[SDL]

Really liking where the RN is going atm....

[Nepeccel]

The ship numbers suggested on this thread would be good! Can't wait to see the new fleet ready

Shame it takes long to make a ship!

[SDL]

How many are to be made?

[marktigger]

Probably None as the UK can't afford them and when the election is over the defence review will gap alot of naval capability to release funding to keep Afghanistan going and repay some of the defecit

[SDL]

Probably None as the UK can't afford them and when the election is over the defence review will gap alot of naval capability to release funding to keep Afghanistan going and repay some of the defecit

you make quite a fair point there.....

[Thom]

Nice post, I was wondering about this the other day. It's certainly exciting times for the RN, even if they do get shafted on numbers which may **** us at some point, it's hard to deny they're not getting some great kit.

[Andy-M]

Just found this picture of what looks like the new T26 being displayed at DSEi 2009, here

http://www.informationdissemination....dsei-2009.html

[happyslapper]

How many are to be made?

It's been posted a few times what current projections are...

Current assumptions call for the construction of up to 10 Type 26 ships, designed as a versatile combatant to protect expeditionary task forces and provide anti-submarine warfare defence

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Probably None as the UK can't afford them and when the election is over the defence review will gap alot of naval capability to release funding to keep Afghanistan going and repay some of the defecit

Considering this project is already overdue, is a high-priority project for the MoD, and that the RN's escorts have been on their knees to provide capability to an eye-wateringly embarrassed government...
I suspect the RN/MoD will aim for 12 and get 10.

Afghanistan has nothing to do with it. It operates from a different budget, increasingly under scrutingy for it's secondary impact on 'mainstream' defence, and it's likely we'll either be out of Afghan or on a completely different operational footing by the time they start cutting steel.

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Good spot Andy M! You can see the similarities in hull form with the T45, and some of the internal 'dock/mission bay' (or whatever you want to call it).