Reply With QuoteI have to ask, what kind of accent does the narrator have? Swedish?
Artillery
NK artillery photographed by a passing foreign tourist:
See tourist trip video here:
I have to ask, what kind of accent does the narrator have? Swedish?
As soon as I saw this picture I've made an inquiry to a local travelling agent regarding the possibility of visiting this museum. Today I got the answer, which was "no". Museum is open to citizens of DPRK only.Originally Posted by _GDS_
Me too, especially whats hidden on the left side(BTR's) and right side(trucks) also, main hall(we can call it Tank and artillery hall) from diferent angles.
Can anyone photo-spy this museum for us?
That's bad v.v But maybe it will can change in future... lets' see or hope for more pics from the news agency.As soon as I saw this picture I've made an inquiry to a local travelling agent regarding the possibility of visiting this museum. Today I got the answer, which was "no". Museum is open to citizens of DPRK only.
However i was re-reading your analys and was checking it with other photos we had.
I find it very interesting, as it was said, probably the best way to know the truths it's that some turist will manage to visit that museum first or later.. and will ask to translate a bit of the descriptions... watching the enlarged pictures it's seems clear that they are all different (there is ever a coloured photo on the right side close to the descriptions) and photos/descroptions of n°138 and n°404 are different.
But i was trying to see better the differences of tank n° 915.
What there is atop the main gun? It's seems different to me but i can't recognize it..
And atop the turret? it' doeasn't seems to me like the machine-gun that have each other tank..
Now..
it could be that ?
n°216 Chonma III
n°138 Chonma IV (better armour)
n° 404 Chonma V protype or Chonma V
n°909 Chonma V or Chonma VI (for what i've read, Chonma VI should be very similar to Chonma V and 404 and 909 seems to have the same armour) If i'm correct that was the most common tank we saw in the last parades and probably the better tank actually in service.
n°915 Pookpong. I think too that simply but an end to the doubt... the shape of the hull, the turret, It's also (at least seems to me) the same of the previous photos of "tank with more round turret and SAM missile" we already seen... or the last one seen in parade without SAM but with ERA as this n°915.
Now...
If we agree however that tank n°909 and tank n°915 are the last and most advanced tanks (the first being Chonma V/VI the last being Pookpong) who is the best tank?
How can they use it in battle?
I've think at first seeing the picture of tank + MANPAD that this could be a very smart idea to try to counter Apache /A-10 ...
Why we've seen MANPAD only on Pookpong and not on Chonma? (while we've seen them also on trucks!!)
Some oldies I acquired a couple of weeks ago:-
Connaught Ranger.
Every NK tank has external laser rangefinder over the gun. This is due to their FCS being apparently derived from some WarPac T-55M upgrades. 915 however seems to have ATGM launch tubes attached over the rangefinder box. Museum photo is the only one that shows this feature. What it has instead of a machine-gun is a mystery to me.
I have noticed one specific recognition point - smoke grenade launcher arrangement. I have concluded 404 to be a prototype since I didn't notice it anywhere on the parade, but taking smoke launchers as a clue you can notice it did participate. So I believe 404 and 909 to be V and VI now. Aside from that, engine is the only real difference. 909 seems to have V-84, while 404 - some kind of V-55 derivative, probably of Chinese origin.
I believe manpads seen during 2010 parade were only for the show. It would be impossible to fire them from where they were attached. The strange thing on museum version of 915 however might be a version of SAM system that actually works.
And yes, tanks with large cast turrets from 2010 parade are the same vehicles wearing ERA now. The fact that turret is cast doesn't make it inferior to latest T-62 versions with welded ones. On the contrary - you may notice weld seams close to the gun mantlet, which along with it's size hint to this turret having composite armor inside.
Additionally 915 seems to be the only tank actually equipped with 2A46:
And also it is the only NK tank equipped with APU.
Last edited by Mr_Levi; 05-15-2012 at 12:20 PM.
Every NK tank has external laser rangefinder over the gun. This is due to their FCS being apparently derived from some WarPac T-55M upgrades. 915 however seems to have ATGM launch tubes attached over the rangefinder box. Museum photo is the only one that shows this feature. What it has instead of a machine-gun is a mystery to me.
Looking at the enlarged phot it seems something of cylindric tube... i've seen something of similar in the last parade mounted on trucks, it could be a "Kornet" (not reported as used by north koreans) or an older "Fagot" that they surely have? I should check better that video... because i'm SURE to have seen them. If they managed to grab some Kornet (after all both Hezbollah and Hamas have them) that can increase their anti-tank weaponery. But it could be aloso some "mix" done by them...
Yeah v.v But it doesn't help the fact that (maybe) NK can do "hybrid" tanks... upgreading some of the older series to the new ones mixing some things.I have noticed one specific recognition point - smoke grenade launcher arrangement. I have concluded 404 to be a prototype since I didn't notice it anywhere on the parade, but taking smoke launchers as a clue you can notice it did participate. So I believe 404 and 909 to be V and VI now. Aside from that, engine is the only real difference. 909 seems to have V-84, while 404 - some kind of V-55 derivative, probably of Chinese origin.
Expecially about the smoke launchers...
Wikipedia on the page "Chonma-Ho" put a very old picture (1992 if i'm correct) of a Chonma with a bit of ERA on the rear of the turret as a Chonma-V but i think that it should be a Chonma- IV at this point v.v while Chonma-II should be tank216 and Chonma-III tank138
Now we can say that Wikipedia should need some corrections v.v
They say that from Chonma-IV all tanks have the new engine...but thank404 has not and it's too advanced compared to the description of the previous Chonma-III
Another problem:
The engine of these (Pokpung-II) seems to be the same of the old Chonma ones... different from tank 909 and 915..
Have you seen photos of the rear of the Pokpung-III in the last parade? If they have the same new one as the tank909 that should be a new difference between Pokpung II and III.
I still think that's impossible to operate one from that position... there can be two option. 1) a crewmember or an infantery soldier can put it out from there and fireI believe manpads seen during 2010 parade were only for the show. It would be impossible to fire them from where they were attached.
2) crewmen can fire it from inside thanks a remote firing system: of course it's not easy aim at an helicopter- slow flying aircraft expecially if we consider that this MANPAD is considered effective against low-flying aircraft only if not flying "Against" the firing position. Still can have some use for helicopters..
It may.. but i've not managed to understand what kind of system it is v.vThe strange thing on museum version of 915 however might be a version of SAM system that actually works.
That's true and really interesting ^^And yes, tanks with large cast turrets from 2010 parade are the same vehicles wearing ERA now. The fact that turret is cast doesn't make it inferior to latest T-62 versions with welded ones. On the contrary - you may notice weld seams close to the gun mantlet, which along with it's size hint to this turret having composite armor inside.
Are you sure? To be honest i'm not an expert and can't say about it v.v That's very interesting ...according Wikipedia Chonma-V and VI with also Pokpung-II and Pokpung-III should all have the 125mm.Additionally 915 seems to be the only tank actually equipped with 2A46:
Now a very difficult question for you XD (because you seems expert v.v) I'm very fascinated and interested about NK military and in the last exercise/military parades i was happy to see some interesting stuff, some new, some not, some redone ecc..
But there is ONE thing i still want to see and it seems that NK generals and admirals don't want make me happy <.<
Anti-ship missiles.
I think it's INCREDIBLE that with the military collaboration between Iran and Nk, North Korean have not show us a copy/derivative of their missiles.
They have Kowsar, Noor, Quader and Nasr.. all of them are sort-of indispensable to face the new SK naval units.
Still they show us in parade their own Termit/Silkworm missile named "KN-01" by Sk but seems do be named "'Keumho-1" by North... that should be almost the same of the Iranian Raad.
At least in this parade we saw something of new..
It was just for few seconds but after the missiles on trucks, are seen few very similar missiles that are longer, towed by the track thanks the enlarged size. Of course it will be probably a new variant just with a bit more range ..
BUT !!
During the large military exercise of some time ago, with the first show a combined stuff of Navy, Air Force and Ground forces...
I remember very well to have seen the launch of a Keumho-1, a few seconds later there is also a SECOND launch of another missile aiming at the little island....
But the video it's too fast and all we can see it's that it's a different missile....
It SEEMED to me... something as a SA-2.... maybe aimed at the island just for that occasion...but i can't be sure of this (the missile is visible for neither a second).
And... after all the "anti-aircraft" training was already seen (with AAA, MANPAD and SA-13).
You've seen that video/remember that point?
Tirana 1985...talk about a flash back.NK artillery photographed by a passing foreign tourist:
See tourist trip video here:
Is there internet in NK and people can use it ?
They've an IntrAnet called Kwangmyong, apart from NK-made materials (science, educational, economic, political, news sites or sites related to schools, istitutions and so on) and mail-system, some (mainly science-related sites) from Interned are connected, but they are before checked by governative staff and censored if there is something that it's not welcomed.Is there internet in NK and people can use it ?
North Koreans may request to allow a site to be seen in that Intranet, but obviously it have to be checked before by the government...
Then of course North korean governemnt it's present on internet with some sites, as KCNA news agency and some youtube channels..
This is Chonma-ho II:
So 216 is at least III. By the way, tank from the 1992 parade assumed to be V actually seems to be the same vehicle as tank216:
Differences include smoke launchers and ERA bricks, which probably weren't even real.
Wikipedia article is the least reliable source I would consider. It contains lots of unquoted and contradictory information, like the description of Chonma-ho II for example, which says it has "boom shields" around the turret (with a quote mark leading to jedsite.info - resource that never had such information). Between second hand facts and assumptions little is valuable among descriptions given there. 125mm gun is a good example - we have seen 6 to 7 versions of NK T-62 kick-offs, but none of them had one.
I do not remember seeing any clear pictures of 915's engine, but I fail to see old compartment on this photo - looks pretty much T-72 to me.
By no means I am an expert, and I haven't seen the video you are talking about. The new missile from the last parade used the same type of towed launcher Soviet Salish missile did, and I reckon some of the Silkworm variants used it as well. It seemed the same size as those on self-propelled launchers to me.
Thank you again ^^ You may not be an "expert".. but you're clear and fast to analyze stuff and give reasonable conclusions v.v
That's the picture of what can be mounted on that tank in the museum...
Some idea? I'm not much comfortable with the difference of tube-launched russian Anti-tank stufff..
These are a pair of photos of the Silkworm style but... i could not take them in the same positon <.< Probably for this one seemed longer then the other
That's the video of that exercise. Apart from the '60years style of all the operations and the '50years of MTBstyle action , it's interesting to see a coordinated navy-ground-airforce NK training.
And there was some unexpected stuff as a video of a SangO submarine sinking a target ship or coordinated flight of MiG-23/29 and Su-25, first imagines of their Hovercrafts and the use of Il-76 for parachute-launching
This is a picture of the missile i've seen
You can find it at minute 03.59
But now that i look better it DOESN NOT seems a SA-2 Guideline ...
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/8rZhxefhDBs" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Sorry... that's the correct link of it
Found via Tanknet:
The latest version of the P'ok-poong-ho, photographed by one lucky Western tourist:
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