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Thread: Plight of Palestinian Christians

  1. #76
    Senior Member OrangeWolf's Avatar
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    Thanks for your posts , the Baba person. It is always good to hear the other side's narrative.

  2. #77
    On Belay... Climb on Climber's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordie View Post
    Including those at the birthplace of Christianity.
    Birthplace of Christianity? where is that? I wont judge your dogma, but thats is a completely historic wrong fact, just a religious dogma. We cant discuss dogmas Ordie........................

  3. #78
    Member BANDbrothers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordie View Post
    Two issues.

    1) Israel is increasingly dependent upon US Social Conservative Christians lobbying support in Washington.

    2) Palestinian Christians are suffering from Israeli containment policy that contributes towards their exodus from the Holy Land.

    The plight of the Palestinian Christians may affect Israel's support from American Christians.

    I think that the Christians support Israel because the idea of all and only the Jews will live in Israel. Because of the messiah and all these things.

  4. #79
    Μολὼν λαβέ Hollis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Baba Person View Post

    Sorry for the long response, but you asked a huge question.
    Thank you for the response. I agree the questions where not simple. I appreciate your response. One aspect of all the politics going on, we don't need to hear any more from the so-called political leaders as we do the people, the real people who live daily. Like in the US, when we get political hot potato issues, there are never solutions, things seem to perpetuate the problem and politicians are more concern with how they position themselves rather than find a real solution.

    Maybe one day, all the outside interests will leave the people alone and let them live in peace.

  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeWolf View Post
    Thanks for your posts , the Baba person. It is always good to hear the other side's narrative.
    You're welcome.

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Baba Person View Post
    You're welcome.
    Thanks for the response as well.

    Question to Baba:

    If the Palestinian Christians were to contimnue to leave the Holy Land, would that radicalize the politics? If so, what would be the consequences towards Israeli /Palestinian realtions?

    Question to Israelis:

    Would the continuation of the occupation (status-quo) be a threat to Israeli Democracy? Anectodally, some of my American Jewish colleagues have been very critical of Israeli policy towards the Palestinians, so much so they are questioning if Israel is a democracy when it rules over a disenfranchised population in the West Bank.

    Given that lasting peace with Arab nations is possible through bi-lateral agreements (Eygpt / Jordan) and not possible through unilateral means (Lebanon / Gaza), Would a lasting peace happen between the Palestinians and Israel happen through bi-lateral means?

  7. #82
    Senior Member GB_FXST's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordie View Post
    Thanks for the response as well.

    Question to Baba:

    If the Palestinian Christians were to contimnue to leave the Holy Land, would that radicalize the politics? If so, what would be the consequences towards Israeli /Palestinian realtions?

    Question to Israelis:

    Would the continuation of the occupation (status-quo) be a threat to Israeli Democracy? Anectodally, some of my American Jewish colleagues have been very critical of Israeli policy towards the Palestinians, so much so they are questioning if Israel is a democracy when it rules over a disenfranchised population in the West Bank.

    Given that lasting peace with Arab nations is possible through bi-lateral agreements (Eygpt / Jordan) and not possible through unilateral means (Lebanon / Gaza), Would a lasting peace happen between the Palestinians and Israel happen through bi-lateral means?

    No.

    Also, you may want make a habit of keeping company with a better informed and less ignorant class of people.

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by GB_FXST View Post
    No.

    Also, you may want make a habit of keeping company with a better informed and less ignorant class of people.
    If moderate Palestinian Christians are leaving.
    That may open the way for Palestinian radicals to fill in the void.
    That in trun would radicalize the politics within Israel.

  9. #84
    Senior Member GB_FXST's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordie View Post
    You don't think Israel's democracy would be affected?
    No, I do not.

    Why should it be?

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by GB_FXST View Post
    To paraphrase Prager, there are Jews who speak Hebrew, and Jews who do not.

    edit: What happened to the "oy vey" response?
    I try to be more mindful in my responses.

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordie View Post
    I try to be more mindful in my responses.
    You have now changed post #83 for the third time ... so, I am unsure of what you are trying to say.

  12. #87
    Senior Member GB_FXST's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordie View Post
    If moderate Palestinian Christians are leaving.
    That may open the way for Palestinian radicals to fill in the void.
    That in trun would radicalize the politics within Israel.
    A more militant Palestinian regime would likely increase the popularity of the Likud. How does a demographic and democratic shift to the right affect the democratic principles of the country?

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    Quote Originally Posted by GB_FXST View Post
    No, I do not.

    Why should it be?
    If a democratic nation controls an area with an disenfranchised population (i.e. no citizenship, no voting rights, no property rights). It may question the legitimacy of that democracy.

    In my opinion, the longer there is no two state solution, the greater the threat towards Israeli democracy. The sooner they can grant and recognize Palestinian independence in the West Bank the better it is for Israel.

    The other alternative would be a single state solution with full equal citizenship and voting rights for all concerned.

  14. #89
    Senior Member GB_FXST's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordie View Post
    If a democratic nation controls an area with an disenfranchised population (i.e. no citizenship, no voting rights, no property rights). It may question the legitimacy of that democracy.

    In my opinion, the longer there is no two state solution, the greater the threat towards Israeli democracy. The sooner they can grant and recognize Palestinian independence in the West Bank the better it is for Israel.

    The other alternative would be a single state solution with full equal citizenship and voting rights for all concerned.
    Palestinians in the WB do not have property rights? News to me. Please document that claim.

    In regards to the question of electoral rights of WB Palestinians, they are not citizens of the state. Consequently, they do not have a right to vote in Israeli elections.

    It is important to note that the matter is not as simple as you portray it because there is no alternative to the Israeli presence in the West Bank until such time as the Palestinians can 1) govern themselves, and 2) engage peacefully with Israel as required per UNSC 242.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GB_FXST View Post
    No, I do not.

    Why should it be?
    It may negate outside Jewish support for the State of Israel.
    Especially from Europe and the United States.

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