Inmate brags about living better in jail than when he was free.

[Dominique]

Really ?
Come on Dom you know like me that plenty of average Joes end in Jail by something that can be labelled as an accident of life

Accidentaly killing or wounding a pedestrian while driving a car (by losing control of the said car)

Being engaged in a brawl while you are only a casual bar customer

Being falsely accused of pedophilia or rape by a delusioned kid or girl

Being grinded by the economical system and ending up in debts

Etc .........

Sure they are not the majority, far from it
But these cases existed and exist and every year they send several average Joes to jail

Really name a case where you know of where you've been criminally charged for being in debt. You also don't go to jail for loosing control of your vehicle, and accidentally killing someone, unless of course you were doing something stupid, that could get you charged with reckless endangerment (you know something silly like driving 110 mph, without your headlights on, down winding road cuase you thought it was cool). If you're involved in a fight, and you use more force than necessary to defend yourself, then yes you can be charged with assault. Because the drunk a$$hole at the end of the bar takes a swing at you, you can't put him in a coma, and think you're going to get off with it was self defense. As far as being falsely accused of rape, yes it happens, but it's not like it's an everyday occurrence. But If a child goes to someone, and says they were raped, you know that if the cops don't pick that individual up, they'd get crucified.

[Dominique]

Drugs and cell phone use are huge problem in alot of jails, and I am talking about "western" ones with a somewhat high standard of security.

Talk to anyone involved in administrating jails or people working with inmates and they will tell you that drugs/drug abuse are a constant problem. Jails are not as air tight as they are often presented in the media.

The simple fact is that as long as you're willing to pay, someone with low moral fiber is willing to smuggle contraband into jails and/or prisons. How tight the facility's security is is going to vary, but the weaker the facility's security procedures, the easier it is to get stuff in. I've seen people do everything from swallowing condoms, to packing it in their ass, or layering it inside of a Christmas card they tried to mail to their boyfriend. My personal favorite was watching someone try to throw a rock, with money wrapped around it, and rolled up in cellophane, over two fences (it got caught on the razor wire).

[Hollis]

Dom, when I was in college, a friend told me of his experience as a guest for the weekend at HOJJ (County Jail in LA). In the middle of the night his room mate, laid out paper on the floor and took a dump on it. He look at my friend and said, "You don't know what I am doing, do you?" Obviously my friend did not. The guy would swallow drugs in some kind of protective pouch, get busted for the weekend, and sell the drugs in those pouches to prisoners. Strange way to make a living, but people do it.

Human ingenuity is limitless.

[Dominique]

Dom, when I was in college, a friend told me of his experience as a guest for the weekend at HOJJ (County Jail in LA). In the middle of the night his room mate, laid out paper on the floor and took a dump on it. He look at my friend and said, "You don't know what I am doing, do you?" Obviously my friend did not. The guy would swallow drugs in some kind of protective pouch, get busted for the weekend, and sell the drugs in those pouches to prisoners. Strange way to make a living, but people do it.

Human ingenuity is limitless.

Sounds about right.

[Macs.]

The simple fact is that as long as you're willing to pay, someone with low moral fiber is willing to smuggle contraband into jails and/or prisons. How tight the facility's security is is going to vary, but the weaker the facility's security procedures, the easier it is to get stuff in. I've seen people do everything from swallowing condoms, to packing it in their ass, or layering it inside of a Christmas card they tried to mail to their boyfriend. My personal favorite was watching someone try to throw a rock, with money wrapped around it, and rolled up in cellophane, over two fences (it got caught on the razor wire).

Add to that a rise of inmates in times of a bad economy versus slashing budgets for jails on the other hand. And on the other hand prisoners who spend years/decades just thinking about where to find a loop in the system.

One of the biggest scandals concerning prison security around here was when the leading circle of the 70s leftwing RAF terrorists shot themselvs with guns they smuggeled into their cells. All because they knew that the prison guards were only allowed to briefly check their files they were carring with them from and to court... And because they found a dumb lawyer who then cut little holes into the filefolder where within he placed the guns for them.

[Mordoror]

Really name a case where you know of where you've been criminally charged for being in debt. You also don't go to jail for loosing control of your vehicle, and accidentally killing someone, unless of course you were doing something stupid, that could get you charged with reckless endangerment (you know something silly like driving 110 mph, without your headlights on, down winding road cuase you thought it was cool). If you're involved in a fight, and you use more force than necessary to defend yourself, then yes you can be charged with assault. Because the drunk a$$hole at the end of the bar takes a swing at you, you can't put him in a coma, and think you're going to get off with it was self defense. As far as being falsely accused of rape, yes it happens, but it's not like it's an everyday occurrence. But If a child goes to someone, and says they were raped, you know that if the cops don't pick that individual up, they'd get crucified.

Dominique
Well we are in two different countries with different law systems but if i look the french "code penal"

Non voluntary homicide is up to 5 years of jail or suspended sentence or a mix of both

Bankrupt is a misdemeanor, here, with up to 5 years of jail

And concerning the problem of raped kids, i whole heartely agree with you but we have also some (bad) examples here


The Outreau case is a criminal case of child ****** abuse, which result in a miscarriage of justice. It gave rise to a trial before the Assize Court of Saint-Omer (Pas-de-Calais) of 4 May 2004 to 2 July 2004, then an appeal hearing before the Court of Appeal in Paris in November 2005 .

It provoked strong emotions among the public and highlighted the shortcomings of the judiciary and certain social actors, particularly in the fight against pedophilia announced as a priority since 1996 at the highest level of government, and in cases of child ****** abuse.
The attitude of the media who still did not respect the presumption of innocence of the accused, was also questioned, their attraction to the "mercantile sensationalism" is now denounced.
The attitude of some of the political class was not free from reproach.

sorry wiki page in French : http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affaire_d'Outreau
As i said, i too agree with you that these kind of cases are minority but they do exist in some proportion. Our (or for instance your) penal and judiciary systems are not perfect and mistakes or overractions can be seen, leading to sending some people in jail while they don't belong there.
That's all what i am saying

[KoTeMoRe]

From a down to earth PoV. In Belgium it is just impossible to have a better life in Prison if:

1. You do not have a family.
2. You do not have friends.
3. You do not have a fvcking goal in life.

Our penitentiary park is let say it frankly ****. We are speaking about 19th century prisons siding with late 60s early 80s prisons and there is jacksquat to do. Nope I am not thinking about gyms and leisure. I am thinking occupation. I am thinking redemtion. I am thinking turning some crapsters around.

Now while I truly respect any vision towards the penitentiary world, let me tell you that Europe (at least Germany, France, Belgium and Italy) have a big ass issue regarding preventive imprisonment before trial. 60% of the Belgian inmates are awaiting trial. IE they are not judged YET. The ratio is 45/50 in Frenchistan and probably the same can be told about Germany. Italy has a special statute, They have an overpopulation of almost 50% of the existing park. To make things worse they have almost 25K foreigners held in for various misdeeds.

I am all for any of these countries inmates to bragg about their detention life. Really.

[Mordoror]

So what is the percentage of people who are really innocent that end up in Jail? When I was in LEO, I never met any. I don't doubt that there are, but the % is probably very very small. Compare that % of really innocent people to those who say they are innocent. Dom was not really off when you look at the statistics. The system is set up with the most of the cards in the favor of the defendant. Part of it is the fact the whole enchilada is administered by humans. Mistakes will happen, in this situation a lot less than some people would have us to believe.

I can't speak for your country, but not here. ^see Hollis's post.

Sorry Hollis and Spartan didn't see your posts before answering the one of Dominique
I agree with you Hollis, i said it in my previous post. These mistakes in the system are very very few in number. But still they can happen (that's for the side of innocent going in jail)
As for commoners or average Joe ending in jail because of what i describe as an accident of life, they are few in number too but they become slightly more significant, especially in our societies which are "sue for everything and see what happens"
The guy accidentely hurting or killing a kid on a pedestrian crossing will more surely go in jail than 15 years ago (and here i am talking about a true accident like a kid running after a ball or crossing in front of a bus)
But of course they are still a minority in regard of true inmates, that i fully agree with you
Anyway i don't think (but that's only my opinion) that any of us is "jail proof" even if we behave like good citizens

I can give you the example of my father who was sentenced for 3 months of suspended sentence because one of his workers (he had a painting company) killed himselff by falling from an scaffolding. The guy was not wearing his safety harness, was told tenth of time that he had too but was a dense head. My father was lucky this time not to get one month of true jail because he was deemed as responsible by the judge. I hope you see what i want to mean with that ewample

[Dominique]

Dominique
Well we are in two different countries with different law systems but if i look the french "code penal" That's all what i am saying

But we're not talking about the French legal system now are we. Here in the US, many of examples you cited, just aren't going to happen.

[Mordoror]

But we're not talking about the French legal system now are we. Here in the US, many of examples you cited, just aren't going to happen.

I know Dominique but i gave these examples as the firsts whuch came across in my mind; I am sure we can find examples of things labelled as misdemeanor in USA and not in France or Europe. This is not the point of my post though

[Spartan10k]

I know Dominique but i gave these examples as the firsts whuch came across in my mind; I am sure we can find examples of things labelled as misdemeanor in USA and not in France or Europe. This is not the point of my post though

You should probably use examples from the US then to make your point (if you can find any). Cause I'll say it again. You don't simply end up in jail in the US without having done something to land you there....

[Dominique]

You should probably use examples from the US then to make your point (if you can find any). Cause I'll say it again. You don't simply end up in jail in the US without having done something to land you there....

Correct. When you find me some examples of actual cases in the US, I'll be more than happy to debate the merits of your argument, until then you might want to sit back and try to learn a little bit more about the US legal system. And I don't mean that as an insult, as the majority of the people reading this thread don't have a clue about it either.

[Mordoror]

@Dominique and Spartan
Ok guys, i ll lurk a bit more (and i took not offense here)
Have a nice day, i ll come back if i find something (yes i am a bit stubborn sometimes )

[Dominique]

@Dominique and Spartan
Ok guys, i ll lurk a bit more (and i took not offense here)
Have a nice day, i ll come back if i find something (yes i am a bit stubborn sometimes )

No worries, you're good.

[digrar]

such bs. the county jail here recently purchased thousands of dollars of gym equipment for inmate use. it boils my blood. why let them get stronger?

One of the more notorious Australian prisoners was beaten to death with the stem of a stationary bike seat. Gym equipment does have a useful purpose on occasion.