Fair enough and I'm quite in agreement; the Su-25 with it's high-calibre explosive(?) rounds, bombs, large range of missiles, etc... will be able to seriously mutate anything at all it comes across; be it tank, infantry, whatever...Originally Posted by artjomh
But that's just the problem - coming across them - this is where the Su-25 would start running into problems if employed in the way that you suggest. North Caucasian rebels very rarely nowadays sit in a nice fortified position that can be marked on the map or even found by just flying around - they are mostly on the move and when they set up camp; you could probably mistake them for just some guys on a hunting trip if you don't look carefully. We really need better surveillance, more accurate instruments, something that will be able to quietly make an appearance and launch a missile before it's even spotted in the sky.
That's just basic Army Intelligence 101. I don't see how a UAV would be able to differentiate a couple of beardies in the forest better than what they do now.
What they do now is get intelligence on a terrorist hideout in the forest, surround it with infantry, block escape routes and then call in artillery or air support to flush them out. I really don't see how a UAV would be some sort of magical bullet that will be able to jump through all the hoops.
A UAV would go along slowly, spot something, then be able to hang around for at least a few dozen secounds, zoom in with its cameras, monitor what the people are doing, what they look like, etc... basically gain a positive ID. A head-count could be made, perhaps some weapons could be identified. If they are on the move; then the UAVs footage would be enough to tell about the direction they are coming from, and the direction they are going.
A Su-25 would zoom by, maybe if the pilot is lucky he would see a tent hidden amongst the trees somewhere or a couple of people moving along a path (since they didn't duck down by the time the Su-25 flew by, they may just be tourists or something) - that's it; no more information than that.
What are you talking about? Most militants are usually found through HUMINT either deep in the forest or in the city. Zoom in on what?
And Su-25/Mi-24 would never be used to gather intelligence, only to deliver a strike.
Right, I'm talking about a patrol aircraft. Like a naval patrol aircraft. Or a sentry/watchman. You patrol the area, you see something suspicious, you check it out. The Su-25 and all the other current equipment, can only be used for strike missions, or at most - oppurtunistic attacks on the way to or from somewhere, if they see an enemy. They can't be used to survey and observe a large area, find rebel encampments, etc... a UAV though could, and it could be used to strike them as soon as they are found too; if they look suspicious enough.
With high degree of probability - the result will be same, as at others "heavy UAVs".
That is = 0
Btw. since its UAV thread, i have a question.
Is it true that UAVs are absolutely useless in jungles? Was mentioned in article about why hunting after some war criminal in central Africa is so hard.
Any means of reconnaissance from above would be deemed useless by heavy foliage cover... manned or unmanned.
Advanced unmanned systems have multi-spectral sensors, but they aren't that good. Heron, reportedly, has been completely useless in Indian jungle, despite having IR sensors.
American RQ-7C Shadow will supposedly have counter-vegetation electro-optical sensor somewhere in 2016, but the efficacy remains to be seen.
I wonder whats the backgroud IR firm in a jungle......big..... right?
A new multi spectral system by Elbit was announced just few weeks ago.
I don'k know much about the Russian doctrine, but the Israeli doctrine evolves constantly towards an increased use of precision munitions at all levels.
Besides their observation role, the drones on all levels - from the battalion level to the strategic one - can be used to enlighten moving targets for aircraft and ground forces that will fire their ammunitions without approaching the zone.
Heavy drones like Heron TP can carry EW loads to disrupt the air defenses of the enemy for long periods of time.
According to some reports, Heron TP can destroy BM in their launching stage with air-air missiles. Few is known about these features.
You will be argued that the "Heron TP" - it's not a flying target? For a modern air-defense? Can you prove it?
A strategic drone, like Heron TP, flies at an high altitude and is out of reach for most threats.
Like any aircraft, it could be targeted indeed. But in a large scale war, it should be employed along with the manned aircrafts in complemtary roles.
One could argue ( thinking on what Kotemore said) that the shear use of firepower as doctrine is inversely proportional to the use of High Technology Information gathering, Communications, Intelligence and Surgical weapons, So we could see a change in the traditional Russian doctrine. Or a mix between them.
The difference is basically political, We dont have political sovereignty, they have, a lot.
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