Defiant Message From Greece

[Corrupt]

German government and law are efficient and productive. Not Germans as a nation. When the system promotes thievery and corruption, the bad seeds will prosper.

Now tell me who elected the German government and designed the laws there? Who created a system that promotes thievery and corruption?

[Mujo2000]

[QUOTE=juxtapose;6181634]Marx never won a Nobel Prize in Economics . And I have read quite a bit of Marx, in his own words rather than simply those of a range of interpreters, to fulfill various requirements in my educational career. As practical economics, not to mention as pleasurable prose, I would not recommend it.

.........................


Finally, bank "bailouts" are not free. In the case of equity injections, much or all of the value of the stakes of previous shareholders has been wiped out. If the money is in the form of lending to the banks, then these instruments have a senior claim to the bank's assets (vs. shareholders), and they need to be paid back. If they are not repaid, then the creditors (i.e. the public) own the bank. The public money is not intended as a gift, never to be seen again. And, as stated previously, in a broad sense, we are bailing out ourselves.
QUOTE]

An angel just got it's wings.

On the subject of bailouts, watch the banks in Greece, Spain, Portugal and Italy. There are "jogs" on them right now. Wait till Greece exits and see what happens in Spain, etc.

[valtrex]

Now tell me who elected the German government and designed the laws there? Who created a system that promotes thievery and corruption?

It's quid pro quo, Corrupt; the problem is not the Greek DNA, but the STATE, more likely, the infastructure of the state. Our fathers and immediate forefathers, experienced three major catastrophes within the space limit of roughly 40 years: The Asia Minor loss which resulted in circa 1,5 mil. refugees who arrived in the Greek mainland in mid '20's and had to be sheltered and fed, the German occupation that brought devastation and tears, and the fratricide civil war. In the fifties something had to be done to reconstruct the ruins of the state and it had to be done quickly. And when something is constructed really quick, it usually is rickety, likely to collapse sooner or later...so, it collapsed. The current Greek problem is not based on DNA or "cultural corruption" (what the fvck!), the problem is the political back-scratching which appeared in the fifties, which was richly fed by our politicians, was accepted by the people (for obvious reasons) and led to the lack of transparency in relations between institutions and citizens. Does it make sense? I hope it does

[KoTeMoRe]

Since you're in the mood for splitting hairs, I'll indulge you :

http://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_priz...ics/laureates/

Evidently, the Nobel people feel that the Economics Prize is a sufficiently reasonable facsimile that it can justifiably be included on its website (though not part of Alfred Nobel's original bequest, given that Alfred lived in an age when economics was considered one step above voodoo in its "scientific" nature). If you peruse the site, you can see that, despite the difference in the "official" name of the prize, the Economics Prize winners are generally referred to as "Nobel Laureates":

http://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/nomination/


As said previously, it is a "Nobel Prize" to the world at large for all practical intents and purposes, on both sides of the pond:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/11/bu...bel-prize.html

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-15241454

I can't believe you actually got me to spend time doing this.

... http://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_priz...hortfacts.html

It is not a Nobel Prize, it is a specific Prize from a Specific Organization. It has been jointly awarded but it is not a Nobel. The Nobel family has been criticizing the move for quite sometime.Rightly so, as economics unlike many other scientific theories are not exactly reproducible, nor completely devoid of political goals.


IDF_Tanker: Indeed. But the fallacy of intent in calling a specific Prize *Nobel* goes beyond the hair-splitting. It is simply a scientific scam. Other than that, you know me, I am always ready to concede defeat to the right people, and juxtapose is fortunately one of them.

[KoTeMoRe]

What do you mean, Greece still have reserves. and They can default the debt.

Greek citizen have a -10% savings proportion. IE they spend alreay in average 10% beyond their income.

[Climber]

Argentina defaulted on part of its external debt at the beginning of 2002. Foreign investment fled the country, and capital flow towards Argentina ceased almost completely. The currency exchange rate (formerly a fixed 1-to-1 parity between the Argentine peso and the U.S. dollar) was floated, and the peso devalued quickly, producing higher-than-average inflation.
Wiki

I am sorry, you dont know what you are talking about. I dont have the time to explain you Argentine economic history, and Economics in general. But get my word as true, you dont know. Ill give you just a clue and you could make a little investigation. Argentine parity with the dollar was by law and completely artificial, making Argentina a Dollar importer, hence Argentina debt was gigantic and the once flourishing industry ( BTW Argentina is not your average third world country) couldn't compete with imported goods, and the parity also made Argentineans to travel a lot, spend like rich people over the world with richness that was not real, not produced by work but by introducing dollars into the economy to keep the parity. When Argentina left the convertibility of the currency, it devaluated to the real value of the Peso, the default was very good for the economy, the devaluated currency made Argentinian again a net exporter of goods and food by value competitiveness, tourism came by thousands, the IMF debt was paid fully, hence those idiots have no more saying in here, the same with the WB, and yes, there is inflation, but not because of devaluation, there is inflation because there is consumers fever, and the economy is based on that, too much credit and too much consumerism.
If you want to know more just dont read wiki. And ask me

[Climber]

Greek citizen have a -10% savings proportion. IE they spend alreay in average 10% beyond their income.

I know how it is that, read my post above. They have to print and default all debts. Its the only way out with out a social explosion. Capitalism have to reset itself from time to time.

[LineDoggie]

70 years ago, similar ideas were expressed by a short guy with a funny moustache; so you are saying 11 mil Greeks lack innovation by nature?
And you are still a member in this board?

Germans are industrious by nature?
What are you, some kind of Germanic suprematist?
Are you for real?
What's going on lately in MPnet, some kind of Nazi gathering?

Yeah Genius I am an Obersturmbannfuhrer sitting at a table in the wannsee, meanwhile greeks elected the neo nazi party last week. I love how yall scream nazi as soon as someone isnt kissing greeces ass on this, yet throw Germany is Nazis around like it's nothing.

[Nyusu]

I am sorry, you dont know what you are talking about. I dont have the time to explain you Argentine economic history, and Economics in general. But get my word as true, you dont know. Ill give you just a clue and you could make a little investigation. Argentine parity with the dollar was by law and completely artificial, making Argentina a Dollar importer, hence Argentina debt was gigantic and the once flourishing industry ( BTW Argentina is not your average third world country) couldn't compete with imported goods, and the parity also made Argentineans to travel a lot, spend like rich people over the world with richness that was not real, not produced by work but by introducing dollars into the economy to keep the parity. When Argentina left the convertibility of the currency, it devaluated to the real value of the Peso, the default was very good for the economy, the devaluated currency made Argentinian again a net exporter of goods and food by value competitiveness, tourism came by thousands, the IMF debt was paid fully, hence those idiots have no more saying in here, the same with the WB, and yes, there is inflation, but not because of devaluation, there is inflation because there is consumers fever, and the economy is based on that, too much credit and too much consumerism.
If you want to know more just dont read wiki. And ask me

10%(official) or 25%(unofficial) inflation is minor thing, ye.

[valtrex]

Yeah Genius I am an Obersturmbannfuhrer sitting at a table in the wannsee, meanwhile greeks elected the neo nazi party last week. I love how yall scream nazi as soon as someone isnt kissing greeces ass on this, yet throw Germany is Nazis around like it's nothing.

Oh, come on, LD, you know you've made a mistake, it's not bad admitting it....
btw it's Greece...

[Vorian]

Now tell me who elected the German government and designed the laws there? Who created a system that promotes thievery and corruption?

Germany had a few things we did not have.

a)Education. Greece before WW2 was a third-world nation in terms of education. Vast majority were barely literate peasants. Not because it's in our DNA but because of many many historic events that go way back. One can better rebuild his country when there are skilled men to do it.

b)Infrastructure. The reason that the Nazis required more than a few days to conquer Greece was not the bravery of our army but the fact that there were no roads to advance. I've seen pics of German motorcycle troops that had to use the railways. Sure Germany had its infrastructure destroyed but again it's easier to rebuild when there is the know-how rather than build from scratch. Including factories etc

c)Size and resources. Self-explanatory.

a)b)c) explain why we could never have the economy of Germany.

d)Most important for me. VISION. German leaders and the German nation could look hopefully to a future where Germany would once again be one of the top dogs of the world. One day. Thus attracting into politics not only greedy bastards but also some people that wanted to lead and have a place in history. Greece had some good leaders while there was a vision (a nationalistic vision that pursued aggression against its neighbors, true). It was shuttered, and it's been ruled by crooks and demagogues ever since. No decent man wants anything to do with politics and when I say there are no alternatives I mean it. I can name none that I would trust with my future right now. NONE.

And closing i will say this to you and many others. STOP insinuating that every Greek is somehow designed as a leech, a lazy conman or simply useless by god. It's offensive, it's racist and should not be tolerated in these forums, but nobody seems to care if the other is being a racist, offensive condesending prick unless he does it against an American, Israeli or W. European apparently.

Feel free to mock this inferior, stupid, lazy, corrupt Greek that cares too much about human bigotry. I'm out.

[LineDoggie]

Oh, come on, LD, you know you've made a mistake, it's not bad admitting it....
btw it's Greece...

I made no Mistake, Germans ARE industrious as a People. taking aerospace as but One example

Dornier
Messerschmitt-Bölkow-Blohm
OHB-system
Premium AEROTEC

They design and produce their own aircraft

What has greece like this?, and it wasnt the Allies who set these companies up, it was Germans.

What Greek aircraft producers are there and their products? Any Fighters? Transports? Trainers? Civil Airliners? Helicopters?

[valtrex]

I made no Mistake, Germans ARE industrious as a People. taking aerospace as but One example

Dornier
Messerschmitt-Bölkow-Blohm
OHB-system
Premium AEROTEC

They design and produce their own aircraft

What has greece like this?, and it wasnt the Allies who set these companies up, it was Germans.

What Greek aircraft producers are there and their products? Any Fighters? Transports? Trainers? Civil Airliners? Helicopters?

Germans are industrious as a people because their law and government help them be productive and industrious.
Do you want me to remind you what you wrote earlier?

Germans are by nature industrious, unlike some other nations which are still in Sheep herding stage

Your people and my people, fought and died together, on the same side, against bigotry some 70 years ago.
It's offensive and racist what you wrote.

[KurtyKat]

Yeah Genius I am an Obersturmbannfuhrer sitting at a table in the wannsee, meanwhile greeks elected the neo nazi party last week. I love how yall scream nazi as soon as someone isnt kissing greeces ass on this, yet throw Germany is Nazis around like it's nothing.

Very well said. And you forgot that Germany still owes so much reparations to Greece because of WW2, and that Angela Merkel will finally fulfill Adolf´s plans not by military but rather economic invasion of Europe. Also we Germans love having our money put on the line or even dumped into a bottomless barrel by our crazy politicians/leaders so that we can assume domination over other countries or maybe the world some day... Putting all the rumors together I wonder of they will someday find out that it was not Romans but rather Germans that crucified Jesus Christ...

Sorry - just my stupid and sarcastic two cents....

(oh, I am not a Nazi German btw. I am half Hungarian and my wife is from Eastern Europe, too)

[Vorian]

Sorry - just my stupid and sarcastic two cents....

Perhaps you should think of something productive to write instead of wasting bandwith on trolling.