and speaking of traditions - 1450s AD. that's when orthodox slavs, descendants of knyaz Vladimir, who sold his nation into religious slavery in exchange for opportunity to intermarry with Byzantium emperors dynasty, conquered, at last, Murom, last remaining Rus city with traditional slavic religion. so it's clearly more traditional to worship Perun, Veles etc than to kiss unwashed paws of orthodox clergy.
not that i give a damn about religion as a whole, but hey, common sense.
Prosecution Seeks 3 Yrs for Pussy Riot Members
Prosecution asked on Tuesday for three years in jail for three Pussy Riot members over a punk prayer in Moscow’s Christ the Savior Cathedral calling for then-Prime Minister Putin to quit.
The three young women - Nadezhda Tolokonnikova, Maria Alyokhina and Yekaterina Samusevich, all aged between 20 and 30 - have been charged with hooliganism under a statute carrying a maximum penalty of seven years in prison.
The prosecutor said the defendants’ actions fell under the definition of “hooliganism,” i.e., a gross disturbance of public order by a group of persons acting in collusion.
He rejected Pussy Riot’s assertion that it was a “political act” as according to eyewitness reports, the defendants made no reference to any politicians during their punk prayer.
The prosecutor said, however, that they mentioned the Russian president’s name in their song only to claim that it was a political act.
The act was “sinful in the eyes of society,” he continued, adding that the Christ the Savior Cathedral is “a symbol of faith for citizens.”
Two of the “victims,” whose names were not disclosed, asked through their lawyer that the Pussy Riot members be given suspended sentences, since two of them had small children.
Pussy Riot’s defense counsel Nikolai Polozov said that any verdict besides not guilty would be unlawful.
Another defense lawyer, Violetta Volkova, said she will complain to the European Court of Human Rights over the violation of the defendants’ rights during the trial.
Court hearings have lasted for more than 10 hours a day, she said, as a result of which the defendants were deprived of normal sleep, were not provided with hot meals or any meals at all.
They were also denied an opportunity to meet with their lawyers in private. The court rejected all complaints and barred witnesses for the defense, members of the public and the media from testifying.
Volkova said all of that amounted to “torture and inhumane treatment.”
The Pussy Riot members told the court they were not guilty and hoped they would be released.
Tolokonnikova said that evidence against the group was falsified while “victims” had come under pressure from the investigation.
Alyokhina said the investigator threatened her with two to four years in jail unless she “cooperated.”
The court adjourned until Wednesday.
Testifying in Moscow’s Khamovniki Court on Monday, Samutsevich said the punk band was formed to draw public attention to criticism of the ruling authorities in Russia and all three of them had no intention of offending Orthodox believers.
The three Pussy Riot members were detained after five masked women performed a song in Moscow’s landmark Christ the Savior Cathedral in late February, speaking out against what they said was church support for Vladimir Putin’s presidential election campaign.
The song, entitled “Holy S**t,” featured the lyrics “Virgin Mary, drive Putin out!” and was performed at a time of unprecedented protests against the 12-year-long rule of the former KGB officer. The suspects admit being part of the Pussy Riot group and partaking in the performance, but say their motives were purely political. Putin called the protest “unpleasant.”
The trial of Pussy Riot members has raised international concern with many famous western rockers voicing support for the girls and asking for their release. In the most recent appeal, former *** Pistols vocalist John Lydon, aka Johnny Rotten, dedicated his whole performance to Pussy Riot during the festival of punk bands, Rebellious, in Britain’s Blackpool.
Amnesty International has recognized the three group members held in custody as prisoners of conscience.
The three women have been in jail since their arrests a few weeks after the performance took place on February 21.
Boy does that sounds like a stupid case, honestly. Fine the Hell out of them and let them go before it turns a whole lot stupider.
Toilet cleaners have a thankless job, their contributions deserve to be mentioned.If you really want revere a group of people what about public toilet cleaners.
However, they don't console suicidals and the depressed, they don't set up mobile hospitals for the homeless, they don't set up charities and they don't shelter outcasts.
And BTW I only asked Asch not to insult them, not to revere them.
And further more, I'm not going to argue anymore about the clergy, find someone else.
Pussy Riot Trial Nears Verdict in Moscow
Read more: http://www.rollingstone.com/music/ne...#ixzz22sZaoMDsJailed feminist punk rockers Pussy Riot told a Russian court on August 6th that their "punk prayer" in Moscow's biggest cathedral was a political statement, not an expression of hate against Orthodox Christians.
"We sang 'Black habit, gold shoulder straps' about the fusion of KGB and the church," band member Nadezhda Tolokonnikova said of the performance. "Our goal was political protest in artistic form. There was no hate, not a drop."
Police jailed Pussy Riot members Tolokonnikova, 22, Maria Alyokhina, 24, and Yekaterina Samutsevich, 29, this past March – charging them with "hooliganism" for staging a performance in Moscow's Christ the Savior Cathedral in which they asked the Virgin Mary to rid Russia of President Vladimir Putin. The court hearings, which began July 30th, have been widely criticized as a politically motivated show trial, with international artists including Madonna, Patti Smith, Sting and Red Hot Chili Peppers calling for Pussy Riot's release.
The breakneck speed of the controversial proceedings continued to stun participants and observers as the judge moved the trial into its penultimate stage – the debates – on Monday evening. Defense lawyers complained that they were not given enough time to prepare for the debates, with just one night to get their materials ready.
After the debate phase, the defendants will offer final statements before the court issues its verdict. Prosecutors are seeking a three-year prison term for the band; the court will likely hand out its sentence before the end of this week. (The maximum sentence for hooliganism is seven years, but Putin recently made a public statement suggesting that the band should not be punished too severely.)
On Monday, Judge Marina Syrova denied the defense's motion to interview Igor Ponkin, an expert who reviewed the case and co-authored a report that stated that Pussy Riot's church stunt was blasphemous and motivated by religious hatred.
Ponkin has collaborated on several projects with Mikhail Kuznetsov, a lawyer of a church guard who has accused Pussy Riot of deeply offending his religious feelings. These projects included a joint letter published last fall to Putin and former president Dmitry Medvedev criticizing a federal education bill for being "atheist" and not having a clear clause on integration of theology into Russia's education system. Ponkin and Kuznetsov also co-wrote a book titled On the Right of Critical Evaluation of Homo******ity.
Syrova upheld the prosecution's objection to interviewing Ponkin on the grounds that the documents linking Ponkin and Kuznetsov were not filed properly. The judge has denied or ignored the majority of defense motions since the beginning of the trial; she has also denied eight requests to remove her from the case.
Syrova did, however, grant the defense a motion to interview more experts and witnesses – but at 9 p.m. on Monday, none of the witnesses had arrived at the Khamovniki court building.
"Your witnesses aren't here?" Syrova asked. "Then the court is moving to the stage of debates."
School is School, Church is Church, pressuring others to follow your beliefs doesn't work out too well, infact it draws people away from your flock.
Last edited by Hisroyalhighness; 08-07-2012 at 12:48 PM.
They are going to jail these women, and they are going to be branded 'political prisoners' and become an ongoing PR headache for the Russian government. But with the ongoing suppression of political, citizen and media dissent in Russia, I guess it is unsurprising.
1. "The whole world would rejoice if the Russian nation has ceased. Life for Russians themselves would be easier if tomorrow no longer had to consider itself the multinational state, and would rather become a small nations like Bodi, Khanty or Avars.
2. "The Russian people belong in jail, not just any prison, namely a sh*t bucket ..."
3. People are not adequate to their interests. The people who excitedly loved Stalin, can not be considered adequate.
4. "In order to buy, you must have money. Russians are not capable of earning anything, so they can not buy anything.
5. "Russian nation - a cancer of humanity!"
6. "The long-suffering people are suffering through their own fault. Nobody is occupied, they have not been conquered, they had not been forced into the prison. They stole from themselves, knocked themselves, imprisoned and shot themselves. That is why this nation is reaping what it deserves."
7. "The Russian character is generally measured in kilometers. Like, the whole breadth of the Russian soul, all its unpredictability and ambivalence, the whole prairie wolf anguish etc. - From the vastness of our territory. Received an alternative proposal: to measure the Russian character in degrees Celsius and millimeters of mercury. Because the entire political climate in the country, as well as the state of the economy, as well as the quality of football - from the nastiness of our weather. While living in Russia, it is difficult not to become a climate Russophobe. Recently, I realized where is a totally unique kind of national black humor - especially ironic boasting incredible tragedy. For example, only in Russia could appear a joke: steamer collided with the plane on the railroad. This is a joke, but for the most part true. I do not know whether to laugh or cry when reading an article about the difficult situation in the Sverdlovsk region, where in some areas plagued by forest fires (fires in our articles are always "raging"), while others were in the zone of flooding. "(Semen Novoprudski)
8. "We can not answer ourselves to very simple questions: where are we going, what we are building, with whom we (in Europe or Asia, or even anyone) that we hold dear in this world that we value and what do we hate? We can not decide on its own history and holidays, with his place in the world (one can not assume this definition, an infinite and almost meaningless diplomatic PR for everyone, even the most petty things). We exist in a rather confusing system of moral guidelines, which are almost hidden in thick fog, that no one outside our borders understands or perceives them as a normal way of life of some semi-criminal everyday existence.
9. This country has expired itself. Its existence is not needed by anyone else - not the ethnic people it occupies nor or its own people - and, moreover, represents a mortal threat to humanity.
10. Targeted killing of the Chechen people - only the first link, the most prominent and visible fact in the chain of countless crimes of the Russian empire. Genocide were here not only the peoples of the Caucasus, but also the Baltic countries and Ukraine (one of the Holodomor of 1932-1933 is worth something!), Bear's paw of the bloodthirsty beast laying until recently all of Central Asia and Kazakhstan ... Today they are at one end of this crumbling empire killing Chechens, on the other - "do not pass the" civilized world Konigsberg, lopped off at one time in Germany, a historic city, transformed them into a typical Soviet provincial dump, and the third - his teeth and claws dug into brazenly stolen islands from the Japanese as a result of treacherous aggression in 1945.
11. "... This is totally a perverted Asian views about the role of state in the life of the country we inherited not only by the Soviet regime - it is forcibly inculcated national consciousness during the ten centuries of Russian history
12 ... While our national consciousness, our internal and external policies are not freed from the complex of statehood - any human rights in our country can not even be dreamed of. But in the eyes of the enlightened humanity we shall remain the absurd straw scarecrow, fit only to have their own experience to teach others how not to live "
13. "Russians seem at times as inferior people, justifying their image in every election every four years by the same insanity - and the same crime! - Statehood. They reached that legally, you see, "banned" Tatar's Tatar language to be translate to Latin? Under the new law passed by the State Duma, speaker of the occupied "the peoples of Russia" should now only use the alphabet of their invaders - the Cyrillic alphabet. For, God forbid, what "anti-Russian" sedition is not leaked, or, God forbid, in general the idea of independence from Moscow. Few people appreciated this "law" for the dignity, and yet it one - is the death sentence of the empire, which had reached such a point of insanity ...
14. "If only Russia refuses to endless conversations about the special spirituality of the Russian people and the special role it plays, then the real reforms can occur. If they are close to the national ego, and seek some sort of special treatment for themselves and to think that bread grows on trees ... They are so admired, they still admire their ballet and his classical literature of the XIX century, that they are already unable to do anything new. "
15. "May 9, 1945 the Soviet people (not the Stalinist regime, no, no means no treatment) is justified to the world for the evil that before and after the war has caused to himself and others.
16. "In this country, goats graze plucked from the flanks, along the fences timidly making their way scabby neighborhoods. <...> In this country was 12 million prisoners, each had his own informant, therefore, here lived 12 million traitors. This is the same country that enslaved as Heavenly King proceeded to bless. <...> I am ashamed of this country, where every day - humiliation, every meeting - is a slap in the face, where everything - the landscape and people - an eyesore.
16. "What a pleasure to come to America and see the overflowing sea of smiles! State of health, physical appearance is largely dependent on the level of life. The way to a smile - through the implementation of the right to wealth. "
17. "It is interesting that the Chechens associate themselves with the Soviet soldiers in World War II, and Russian troops - sometimes jokingly, sometimes seriously - with the Germans. That night we walked past the Russian positions, and the Chechens handed: "Quiet, close to the Nazis"
18. I continue to believe that well-known expression of the Soviet classic "country of fearless idiots" - the best definition of the Soviet Union, has not lost its relevance after the loss of the Soviet empire. It's not about boundaries. It's about people. "It's hard and tedious in the country fearless idiots" - wrote Ilf. And it seems, forever true.
So these women deserve kangaroo court show trials with ridiculously long sentences? Reporters who criticize the Kremlin deserve to be beaten or killed? Political opponents deserve to be arrested and jailed on trumped-up charges?
I cannot believe you are defending the fascist actions of this government.
You love making assumptions don't you? If that's true why are all the dissidents on post 117 still alive?Reporters who criticize the Kremlin deserve to be beaten or killed?
Attacking OMOH, assaulting Nashi Counter-Protesters and protesting on streets not designated for protests and without permits. Also those who are arrested and escorted to the scary blue van spend five hours in the Drunk tank, making faces and obscene gestures at the police guards and then they are promptly released.Political opponents deserve to be arrested and jailed on trumped-up charges?
Infact one of the Opposition biggest leaders recently assaulted a OMOH officer and bystander and guess what he received? 120 hours of community service.
(Yawn) That's a popular word to throw around.I cannot believe you are defending the fascist actions of this government.
Also if this was truly a Fascist action all these women would have been sent to a Penal colony for 20 years and all their relatives and supporters incarcerated.
So no suppression of dissent, all is well in Mother Russia? Cool story, bro.
Russian police raid homes, trying to suppress dissent
Putin's NGO law 'suppressing dissent'
If you can’t suppress them, squeeze them
The Kremlin is building the legal framework for authoritarian rule
Russia: Criminal Libel Law a Blow to Free Expression
Russia’s Perversion of Justice
The Crime Of Russian Law Enforcement – Analysis
Last edited by Ought Six; 08-07-2012 at 03:21 PM.