The growing militarization of civilian police

[junglejim]

Yes.

However speaking as an Australian, the role of the Police has never been to safe guard the government from the Military. That is the point I was sharing with Jungle Jim.

That was just one aspect and one unit of the PNP, which is the SAF, but the military mindset is in the entire organization. Thats is why for me more than the training that they get, it is the mindset that needs to be in check. Hollis already made a point that what prevenets the militarization is civilian oversight outside the LEO org.

[timetraveller]

Yes, I said UK police are well armed and yes they are well armed, If there numbers are 7000 is not bad as per the need ( What your Gov dictates ) You dont need a AR or MP5 for a traffic police ? In this sense many more dont need MP5 or AR..

I am sure the numbers are fine, And UK does have well armed and trained police force to combat terrorists..
And if there Gear update as situation demand then its not bad either, After all it will be used to save lives..

But that dont mean they are getting militarized, Militarized is a very different term..


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I cannot compare a regular with AK with a SF guy with an AK..

You have no experience or have any prime knowledge of British policing in general .. Any serving Police officer that wishing to be part of a ARU some of which are two man team in patrol cars so thus having an effective response time if the case needs so .. has to go thro rigorous selective training .. and even after than they are sent on evaluation courses to even maintain There firearms certificate to be allowed to handle firearms in public and able to follow correct procedure..

the normal beat officer does not carry any such firearms only those who have qualified to become ARU's and the cars that do carry all look the same as the next police car so nobody have any idea at all ... the only time you see visiable armed police is for special events ie Royal visits , foreign delegates and Olympics

[Navel Lint]

[Connaught Ranger]

In Romania untill some years ago the Police, Gendarmerie(jandarmi) and Firefighters were military units where conscripts(except police) carried their year long bull**** "serving the country" tour.
So as said above you would see firefighters guarding the firestation with AK47s and bayonets !
So untill the mid 2000s the sight of mixed police/Gendarmerie patrols in ALL parts of a city were common, the police carried a 7.65mm Carpati pistol and the gendarmes an AK-47 with bayonette.
These sights were more common in Transilvania than in Bucharest.

From the mid 2000s they were all demilitarized and made into civvilian force, proabaly to comply with EU standards.
These days they look like this http://www.jandarmeriaromana.ro/ro/G...o/Galerie.html Ak-47 style weapons are gone replaced by what look like SiG pistols and Glocks in normal street patrool but many times they dont carry firearms especily in more friendly areas.
But this is all due to our criminals and mafia being stupid compared to what you see in US, Russia or other hotspots.

I agree to the original problem i saw american riot police/swat and regular police that more look like SEALs than police and that i don`t agree you dont need full body armor on fat guys with M16 to control a demonstration or riot

Actually, since military conscription ended in Romania about 4-5 years back, there was a lessening in the carrying of military weapons grade (A.K.'s) while on public duty, also in some areas of the country, the fire-brigade has been privatized, but, in other areas the Fire-brigade are still on the books of the MIA and still receive their funding via them, the bayonets, guns, and camo are gone, or at least out of sight, the Jandarmeria are still a para-military force trained along military lines and have at their disposal an array of weaponry.

And, no! the Jandarmeria escort for the football fans was carrying some type of 9mm sub-machine gun as well as having an Alsatian on a leash, others were armed with pistols and a few were carrying back-pack C.S. Gas dispensers.

Connaught Ranger.

[Hollis]

Head shot?

That only happens if they are using a aim bot.

[Mackie]

HE ran, then escaped from arrest, not so innocent at that point

Shooting a running man in the back with a MP5 is just lousy.

[Kunal Biswas]

two man team in patrol cars so thus having an effective response time if the case needs so ..

That is good move..

the only time you see visiable armed police is for special events ie Royal visits , foreign delegates and Olympics

And terrorist attack or Criminal with Automatics..

[Corrupt]

And terrorist attack or Criminal with Automatics..

Yes, but they're usually called in as a response, rather than being there beforehand.

[Mackie]

Most terrorist attacks happened because of organizational mistakes in security agencies.
Instead of avoid these we created more useless agencies and a fest for weapon manufactorers.

[Kunal Biswas]

Yes, but they're usually called in as a response, rather than being there beforehand.

You are saying that ARU stay in office not patrolling..

Coz if they are patrolling that means they are deployed in a area..

[Laconian]

Idiotic pontificating in this thread is the same as it was the last time this subject came up.

I send people into harms way on a fairly regular basis and because someone is uncomfortable with the way he/she is dressed, or wearing visible ballistic armor or doesn't like the idea that the LEO is carrying semi-auto rifle to serve a warrant, I'm supposed to increase the agent's personal risk?

Maybe we should just do away completely with going to get bad people who are preying on the rest of society. We'll just send them strongly worded twitter messages until they turn themselves in.

[junglejim]

Idiotic pontificating in this thread is the same as it was the last time this subject came up.

I send people into harms way on a fairly regular basis and because someone is uncomfortable with the way he/she is dressed, or wearing visible ballistic armor or doesn't like the idea that the LEO is carrying semi-auto rifle to serve a warrant, I'm supposed to increase the agent's personal risk?

Maybe we should just do away completely with going to get bad people who are preying on the rest of society. We'll just send them strongly worded twitter messages until they turn themselves in.

As long as the font is not Stenciled.

[welshmann]

You have no experience or have any prime knowledge of British policing in general .. Any serving Police officer that wishing to be part of a ARU some of which are two man team in patrol cars so thus having an effective response time if the case needs so .. has to go thro rigorous selective training .. and even after than they are sent on evaluation courses to even maintain There firearms certificate to be allowed to handle firearms in public and able to follow correct procedure..

the normal beat officer does not carry any such firearms only those who have qualified to become ARU's and the cars that do carry all look the same as the next police car so nobody have any idea at all ... the only time you see visiable armed police is for special events ie Royal visits , foreign delegates and Olympics

Not around here fella,dunno about rest of the country,Marked BMW 4x4's blacked out windows.

[kamazz]

Idiotic pontificating in this thread is the same as it was the last time this subject came up.

I send people into harms way on a fairly regular basis and because someone is uncomfortable with the way he/she is dressed, or wearing visible ballistic armor or doesn't like the idea that the LEO is carrying semi-auto rifle to serve a warrant, I'm supposed to increase the agent's personal risk?

Maybe we should just do away completely with going to get bad people who are preying on the rest of society. We'll just send them strongly worded twitter messages until they turn themselves in.

thats not the issue that was brought up. The issue is that small towns across america are arming themselves to the teeth courtesy of the pentagon grant, read the article. This isnt a question of safety for cops who patrol high crime areas.

[Corrupt]

You are saying that ARU stay in office not patrolling.

Coz if they are patrolling that means they are deployed in a area..

There are 7000 AFOs in England and Wales out of 136,000 officers. The overwhelming majority of policing is done without guns. Armed police are only deployed when there is a specific need for them, either as an armed response to a crime, or to provide additional security in high threat areas.