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    the Ralph Wiggum of Mp.net. timetraveller's Avatar
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    Default Japanese Air Aces ...

    In this footage at the 4sec mark there is a visual of 2 Zero's one has 16 markings ..the wingman has 11 . I know this is a longshot but would anyone know the ID of those 2 pilot's and year that was filmed .. and is there any current DVD's with Interviews of Japanese Aces


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    Bush Lawyer, that's me! TheKiwi's Avatar
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    All I know is that a lot of Japanese made ace in the Malaysian campaign shooting down POS Buffalo's that the RAF thought were good enough for the far east...

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    Senior Member G-AWZT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by timetraveller View Post
    In this footage at the 4sec mark there is a visual of 2 Zero's one has 16 markings ..the wingman has 11 . I know this is a longshot but would anyone know the ID of those 2 pilot's and year that was filmed .. and is there any current DVD's with Interviews of Japanese Aces



    One is a Zero, the other is a Nakajima Hayabusa "Oscar". Osprey books has a title for Ki-43 Oscar Aces of the Pacific War. You might want to get a copy off of Amazon.

    This website has good information on many types of aircraft colors both old and modern(more or less):

    http://wp.scn.ru/en/ww2/f/768/65/0

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    Senior Member Sootan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheKiwi View Post
    All I know is that a lot of Japanese made ace in the Malaysian campaign shooting down POS Buffalo's that the RAF thought were good enough for the far east...
    Quote Originally Posted by G-AWZT View Post
    One is a Zero, the other is a Nakajima Hayabusa "Oscar". Osprey books has a title for Ki-43 Oscar Aces of the Pacific War. You might want to get a copy off of Amazon.

    This website has good information on many types of aircraft colors both old and modern(more or less):

    http://wp.scn.ru/en/ww2/f/768/65/0
    I once read about air combat in the sky of Surabaya (a city in East Java), where Japanese aircraft (mostly Zeros) raped the remaining Dutch defender early in the Dutch Indies campaign. I couldn't find any online resource though. Maybe you know something about it?

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    Tom of Mumbai thounaojamtom's Avatar
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    those aircraft are Ki-43-II Oscare
    there were six Japanese Ace who have scored 16 kill
    they were
    Rank Name Unit(s) Score
    Maj Kisohi Namai 33rd Sentai 16
    Lt Tameyoshi Kuroki 33rd Sentai 16
    Wo Misao Inoue 16th Sentai 16
    Sgt Mj Yukoi Shimokawa 50th Sentai 16
    Wo Mitsuo Ogura 24th Sentai 16
    Sgt Tomesaku Igarashi50th Sentai 16
    and there were two pilot with 11 score
    Lt Col Mitsugu Sawada 1st Sentai 11
    Capt Hironojo Shishimoto 11th sentai 11
    I have some refercene pictures however not the particular oscar

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    Senior Member pocoloco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheKiwi View Post
    All I know is that a lot of Japanese made ace in the Malaysian campaign shooting down POS Buffalo's that the RAF thought were good enough for the far east...

    Brewsters were good fighters... well, good enough for Finland at least, obtaining 30:1 victory ratio before being replaced by Bf-109s in 1944.

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    L O L A JCR's Avatar
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    Japanese aces are a difficult subject as the IJN and IJA didn't count individual victories until 1944 or so and never had a victory confirmation process comparable to the US or Germany until then.
    So most of the victory counts of earlier aces are their own reckoning, and usually way too high.
    There are however also pilots who never recieved credit for their victories like the Zero pilot who shot down 5 P-40s and a Catalina all by himself during the Darwin raid, as confirmed by allied sources.

    And the late war victory markings on aircraft could mean anything from combats engaged to damaged aircraft and usually were for the individual aircraft, not for the pilot.

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    Tom of Mumbai thounaojamtom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JCR View Post
    Japanese aces are a difficult subject as the IJN and IJA didn't count individual victories until 1944 or so and never had a victory confirmation process comparable to the US or Germany until then.
    So most of the victory counts of earlier aces are their own reckoning, and usually way too high.
    There are however also pilots who never recieved credit for their victories like the Zero pilot who shot down 5 P-40s and a Catalina all by himself during the Darwin raid, as confirmed by allied sources.

    And the late war victory markings on aircraft could mean anything from combats engaged to damaged aircraft and usually were for the individual aircraft, not for the pilot.
    Agreed, to put Victory roundel in aircraft in some unit(s) if not all was forbidden. the book mentioned G-AWZT, I do have the book there was only Oscar with victory painted on his tail fin belonging to 50th sentai/3rd Chutai, flown by Sgt Satoshi Anabuki and Lt Shigeru Nakazaki, Toungoo, Burma.

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    L O L A JCR's Avatar
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    Anabuki is a very weird case, as he seems to be one of the few aces in WW2 of all sides who deliberately lied about his combats.
    In "Air War for Burma", Christopher Shores argues the whole 50th Sentai sometimes made up whole air combats to save face when they failed at a certain task.
    There are only very few confirmed victories for Anabuki and the whole 50th.
    However, the other Ki-43 unit in Burma, the 64th Sentai, usually claimed very accurately.
    Two units of the same air force and the same role in the same theater seem to have had a wholly different leadership culture.

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    Senior Member Marsch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by timetraveller View Post
    ..the wingman has 11 .
    No, he has 14.

    Quote Originally Posted by JCR View Post
    Anabuki is a very weird case, as he seems to be one of the few aces in WW2 of all sides who deliberately lied about his combats.
    In "Air War for Burma", Christopher Shores argues the whole 50th Sentai sometimes made up whole air combats to save face when they failed at a certain task.
    There are only very few confirmed victories for Anabuki and the whole 50th.
    However, the other Ki-43 unit in Burma, the 64th Sentai, usually claimed very accurately.
    Two units of the same air force and the same role in the same theater seem to have had a wholly different leadership culture.
    I actually doubt that the Japanese would make up something like this "to safe face". They're simply not the types for such things.

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    Bush Lawyer, that's me! TheKiwi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marsch View Post
    ...I actually doubt that the Japanese would make up something like this "to safe face". They're simply not the types for such things.
    Um, their whole history of warfare between 1931 and 1945 was over saving face. Why do you think they wouldn't indulge in this in air combat records too?

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    Senior Member Marsch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheKiwi View Post
    Um, their whole history of warfare between 1931 and 1945 was over saving face. Why do you think they wouldn't indulge in this in air combat records too?
    If you say so. What ever I'm not talking about the Japanese as people but about individual Japenese soldiers in this case pilots and as I got it they had a very high understanding of honor. So I think they would have rather commited Seppuku before making up stories and lie about their results. Maybe this was done by higher echelons of the unit to please their command but I even doubt that.

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    Bush Lawyer, that's me! TheKiwi's Avatar
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    The Japanese history of WW2 is consitantly full of incidents of military personal not wanting to report failure and so making things up. This runs from the lowest privates to the highest generals and admirals.

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    Senior Member Marsch's Avatar
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    Care to give an example on the same scale as what we're talking about here?

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    L O L A JCR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marsch View Post
    Care to give an example on the same scale as what we're talking about here?
    I don't have the book right now but from Shores' research into air war over Burma it seems that every time the 50th Sentai lost a bomber they were supposed to escort or failed to intercept allied bombers, they reported large air battles and large numbers of kills to compensate, none of which are supported in allied records.
    Which had the consequence that the 64th Sentai, which in reality had a sterling service record, was always seen as less glamorous, while in reality it probably was the best japanese fighter unit anywhere.
    Even according to allied records, it maintained a positive kill-loss ratio over Spitfires and Mustangs with Ki-43s well into 1944!

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