Reply With QuoteFrom the Hellenic Nautical Week Demonstration at Ioannina
the personel in woodland camo belongs to the MYK of the Hellenic Navy...
2 Great photos from the Hellenic A/A System "Artemis-30"
From the Hellenic Nautical Week Demonstration at Ioannina
the personel in woodland camo belongs to the MYK of the Hellenic Navy...
Could I ask for more info on that AA-system? It looks like a modern interpretation of the ZU-23.
The Artemis 30 is a 30mm AA gun system using the Mauser MK30F ordnance and a special carriage incorporating the magazines and the power supply generator which can be detached and deployed away from the carriage.
The Mauser Arrow, used by Thailand is an essentially similar system.
The Hellenic company Ellinika Amyntika Systimata ( www.eas.gr ) has developed versions mounting Stinger or Igla missiles above the guns, and a version able to use Oerlikon AHEAD ammunition as well.
E-44 E1 81mm Mortar
The E-44 E1 mortar is a Hellenic product made by EBO.
The Hellenic Army has a total of 460 E-44 E1 81mm mortars,there has been placed an order for 430 more.
The E-44 E1 incorporates features of modern requirements and is capable of firing all types of 81MM mortar
Here:
http://www.eas.gr/pyrkal/index.htm
you can find some of the 81mm mortar shells produced by the Greek company PYRKAL.
Go to products->defensedivision->mortarammunition
I quote for the 81mm mortar:
Cartridge 81mm
Cartridge 81mm is Mortar ammunition of High Explosive type (M374A2) or Target Practice type (M374)
Firing from US M1, M29, M29A1 and Thomson Brandt's 81mm mortars, it is used against personnel and material targets with both fragmentation and blast effects
PYRKAL's 81mm Mortar ammunition complies fully with all NATO military specifications and test methods
TECHNICAL DESCRIPTION
The Complete Round of 81mm Mortar ammunition consists of:
Projectile: Steel body
High Explosive Charge: Composition B
Fuze: Point Detonating GRM11A1
Fin Assembly: Type M170, made of an aluminum alloy
Primer Percussion: Type M71A2
Ignition Cartridge: Type M285
Propellant Charge:9 propellant increments filled with M9 Powder in flakes.
BALLISTIC DATA
(*)Propellant (**)Muzzle Velocity (m/s) (***)Maximum Range (m)
(*)Only by the Ignition Cartridge (Charge "0") (**)64 (***)403
(*)Full Charge (**)261 (***)4500
(Credit goes to @Kornet-e and @Kinmid)
Thanks, so it is a modern ZU-23.Originally Posted by Dark Avenger
Twin towed AA gun. Basically same league, different origin and caliber. If I were to use a Russian style designation, I'd call it "ZU-30-2"
Nick's message via Dark Avenger
Angrykirill, my good friend Nick_Karatzides (temporarily unavailable), asked me to pass for him to all of you the following message to clear up this 'ZU-23 VS Artemis 30' misunderstanding:
Could I ask for more info on that AA-system? It looks like a modern interpretation of the ZU-23.The Artemis 30 is a 30mm AA gun system using the Mauser MK30F ordnance and a special carriage incorporating the magazines and the power supply generator which can be detached and deployed away from the carriage. The Mauser Arrow, used by Thailand is an essentially similar system. The Hellenic company Ellinika Amyntika Systimata ( www.eas.gr ) has developed versions mounting Stinger or Igla missiles above the guns, and a version able to use Oerlikon AHEAD ammunition as well.
The ZU-23 AA GUN and the Artemis 30 AA SYSTEM have much more differencies than a poor donkey comparing to a lion. Let's examine briefly these 2 different AAs to proove WHY they are so different:
The ZU-23 AA artillery GUN (click HERE for picture) was developed during the 1950s for Soviet Union requirements and finaly entered in active service during late '50ies - early '60ies. It's a typical cold-era 23 mm twin AA gun mounted on a two wheel chassis, equiped with very simple sighting mechanisms mounted on the upper mount. Needs two gunners as a crew and it is 'powered' ONLY manual and controled by rotating (2nd WW type) levers! The first gunner (click HERE for picture) operates the sight by inserting manually approximate target data to turn collimator sight, insert altitude and overtake angles. The other member is holding collimator sight's cross on the moving target. Feeding is provided from the 50 cartridge belts each, placed in the ammunition boxes. Two more crew members are intended to replace these ammunition boxes (click HERE and HERE for picture).
For additional ZU-23 AA gun pictures, click HERE, HERE, HERE and HERE).
On the other side, the Artemis 30 AA SYSTEM (click HERE for picture) was developed and sponsored by the Hellenic Ministry of Defense (through the Hellenic Army with support from the other Greek armed services) during the 1990s and finaly entered in active service during late '90ies - early '00ies. It was developed to protect all branches of the Armed Forces from medium and low level attack aircraft.
The system is based around the 30 mm cannon and it's advanced targeting system. The effective range is 3500 meters and the continus rate of fire is 1600 rounds per minute. It is equiped with a FULLY digitized surface to air fire control unit, also compatible with Thomson-CSF Crotale surface to air missile system, based on the Matra R.440 missile and called ''Apollo'' by the Greeks. This means that the Artemis 30 AA system, can be integrated as a complete air defense system, with NO personel required seating on the gun. It was lately announced that the FIM-92 Stinger surface to air missile would be integrated with the Artemis 30 anti-aircraft system too. The German Lenkflugkörpersystyeme firm, a component of Daimler Benz Aerospace and European licensee for the production of the Stinger, has teamed with Hellenic Arms for the integration. As of the time of the announcement, this development effort was being privately funded in anticipation of a domestic requirement.
While the Artemis 30 can be operated autonomously, the weapon achieves its greatest flexibility and efficiency when operated as part of a eleven unit battery, in which eight units are the firing components (the carriages each mounting two cannon), one unit is the Battle Coordination Post, and the last two units are the Fire Control Centers. The Artemis 30 system can be easily integrated with a variety of existing fire control systems. The contractor has collaborated with various firms in this field regarding the integration of these fire control systems with the Artemis 30.
As it is now deployed, the Artemis 30 anti-aircraft artillery system is configured in the following manner: The Battle Coordination Center incorporates the X (I) band pulse-Doppler acquisition radar capable of detecting targets at 30 kilometer (18.64 mile) ranges. A secondary Ku (J) band radar is used for tracking and identification purposes and is capable of tracking up to 20 targets simultaneously. A command/control computer is also provided. The target data are then transmitted via land line to the Fire Control Centers. The Fire Control Centers can each direct up to six Artemis 30 systems (12 cannon) with passive, semi-active or active operation depending on the choice of sensors. An electro-optic system with an auto tracker, tracking radar, with an infrared camera with an auto tracker and a laser rangefinder are provided at the user's option. These components are mounted on a common pedestal placed on a militarized truck/trailer vehicle. A single operator is required for the system. The Artemis 30 fire unit can be set up to operate by remote control.
So, my friend Angrykirill, do you still believe that the ZU-23 AA gun has still any similarities with the Artemis 30 system? Seems closer to the "Skyguard" AA system to me (which includes radar, 30 mm guns and the RIM-7M Sparrow missile launchers) than an old fashioned cold-era typed 23 mm twin gun. Isn't it?
PS 1. Did you mean ZSU-23 instead of ZU-23?
PS 2. Off-topic, but just for the History, click HERE, HERE and HERE for a picture of Mrs Jane "Aerobic" Fonda, seated on a North VietNam ZU-23 AA gun, while "protesting" for love 'n' peace... during the early '70ies.
Thanks for hosting,
Nick_Karatzides
Last edited by Dark Avenger; 10-19-2006 at 10:27 AM.
Thanks for the info, wonderful stuff. And no, I just meant that allthough this gun is millions of times more advanced than the ZU-23, it still reminds me of it. The general purpose, allthough the technical characteristics are much improved, is still similar. You can put it this way, this would be the modern day ZU-23 replacement, like you can say some new rifle is a modern version of a popular old rifle (fx the Mosin Nagan sniper rifle). The Skyguard is different because it isn't much newer than the Zu-23, that is if we are talking about the 30mm Oerlikons. And no, allthough there aren't much similarities between the ZU23 and this greek system, it distinctly reminds one of the ZU-23 as one of the first really massive AA systems, or if you go even farther back you can compare with the WW2 german AA systems. Sorry for any misunderstandings
Again, thanks for the info, this is one expensive toy. I think it would be more wise to put this system at least on a chassis instead of it being towed? Even a truck chassis would do wonders.
EDIT: Yeah, that Fonda pic sure stirred up **** back in the day. She lost lots of popularity because of that.
Forgot to correct the fact that "Hanoi Jane" did not actually sit behind a 23mm gun, but a 37mm one.
EMB-145AEW
Re: Unit Production Figures cited earlier
In an earlier post, a bar graph citing unit production figures for the Artemis 30 AA system was posted. I was hoping for a definition of "Units". Do they mean whole batteries or individual platforms. If it means individual platforms, does anybody know what the breakdown of platforms is (i.e. guns platforms, radar platforms, controller platforms, power units, etc?).
In other words how many batteries does 31 units mean?
Thanks
MAGNA RIB 44
More pictures of the @Artemis-30
(Credit goes to @Kornet-E)
Posting Permissions
