Thread: Israel Defense Forces (Read First Post!)

  1. #12271

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    Quote Originally Posted by joash View Post
    Even if they are using blanks as they clearly are with the rifles, dry exercises should be performed the same way a live fire wet exercise or real life operation is performed.

    Otherwise mistakes will be made in real life.

    I have no idea why anyone would be criticizing YAHALOM from a few pictures of a photo op training session. Have you actually seen them train/operate?
    After training and doing joint operations with YAHALOM (and Oketz which also happen to be in some of the pictures), my opinion is that their training is fantastic and operate at an extremely proficient level.

  2. #12272
    Senior Member NimDod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tanks_alot View Post
    nice job with the ammo box for the 0.5" on top of the gun.
    not having it on the left of it reduces the chance that the loader will shoot it by accident.

    But why did they remove the loader's MAG?

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    Member Marsh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NimDod View Post
    nice job with the ammo box for the 0.5" on top of the gun.
    not having it on the left of it reduces the chance that the loader will shoot it by accident.

    But why did they remove the loader's MAG?
    Hi,

    Most Merkava 4s for reasons involved with enhanced ballistic protection, are not fitted with a loaders hatch. (They can be). Hence the lack of loader's MAG.

    Marsh

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    Tel Aviv Stud tanks_alot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marsh View Post
    Hi,

    Most Merkava 4s for reasons involved with enhanced ballistic protection, are not fitted with a loaders hatch. (They can be). Hence the lack of loader's MAG.

    Marsh
    How do they make Artishok ambushes work without a loader's hatch?

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    Quote Originally Posted by tanks_alot View Post
    How do they make Artishok ambushes work without a loader's hatch?
    Hi,
    Sorry, what does Artishok mean?
    Marsh

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marsh View Post
    Hi,
    Sorry, what does Artishok mean?
    Marsh
    Artishock means artichoke.

    I'm referring to standard tank ambushes, in which it's the loader's job to guard the close proximity of the tank.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marsh View Post
    Hi,
    Sorry, what does Artishok mean?
    Marsh
    Tank ambushes

  8. #12278
    Member Marsh's Avatar
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    Hi,
    I presume that they would need to re-organise SOPs for such ambushes. In any case, there will need to be revision of such tactics with the advent of active-defence systems such as Trophy.
    There was an argument within the IDF as to was it worth it to lose the loader's hatch. Not having one does increase ballistic integrity against top attack. this is at the cost of situational awareness. You probably are aware that some of the Merkava 4s in service now have a loader's hatch, for reasons not be discussed here.

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    Senior Member NimDod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marsh View Post
    Hi,

    Most Merkava 4s for reasons involved with enhanced ballistic protection, are not fitted with a loaders hatch. (They can be). Hence the lack of loader's MAG.

    Marsh
    Hi Marsh,
    I thought that the round object where the loader's hatch (right of the commander's hatch, behind the sight) in the posted picture is a loader's hatch.
    if not, than what is it?
    and why remove a loader's hatch if you could can just have one (heavily armored, like the commander's) and leave it closed?
    IMO, removing the loader's hatch takes most of the fun of being a loader.

    Also, I'm not fimiliar with the name "Merkava 4S". what does the S stand for?
    what's the difference between a Merk 4 and a Mark 4S other than Trophy?

    (of course, if allowed to answer, OPSEC and all that)

    thanks.

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    Senior Member Damian90's Avatar
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    Tank on posted photo have loaders hatch in opened positions. But like Marsh said, not all Merkava Mk4 have this hatch installed.

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    Senior Member NimDod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Damian90 View Post
    Tank on posted photo have loaders hatch in opened positions. But like Marsh said, not all Merkava Mk4 have this hatch installed.
    thanks.
    Cant say I understand the logic behind having a loader's hatch, but not adding a loader's MAG.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NimDod View Post
    Hi Marsh,
    I thought that the round object where the loader's hatch (right of the commander's hatch, behind the sight) in the posted picture is a loader's hatch.
    if not, than what is it?
    and why remove a loader's hatch if you could can just have one (heavily armored, like the commander's) and leave it closed?
    IMO, removing the loader's hatch takes most of the fun of being a loader.

    Also, I'm not fimiliar with the name "Merkava 4S". what does the S stand for?
    what's the difference between a Merk 4 and a Mark 4S other than Trophy?

    (of course, if allowed to answer, OPSEC and all that)

    thanks.
    Hi NimDod,

    Have a look at this thread on Tanknet. Some nice photos of the loader's hatch.
    http://208.84.116.223/forums/index.php?showtopic=26241

    All Merkava 4s (s just to donate the plural, not a different mark or modification) have the capacity for the fitting of a loader's hatch. I don't want to go into more detail, but think how the instructor sits on a Merkava 4 when the external bucket seat is attached.....

    cheers
    Marsh

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    Senior Member NimDod's Avatar
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    thanks for clearing that

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    [*******#333333][FONT=Arial]Israeli soldiers watch as a missile is launched from the Iron Dome defence system in the southern Israeli city of Beer Sheva on March 12, 2012[/FONT][/COLOR]

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    Default Geffen Battalion

    [FONT=Verdana]Israeli Defence Force officer cadets from the Geffen[/FONT][FONT=Verdana] Battalion at Training Base 1 during a field training exercise - storming straight into thorny bushes and dense vegetation, preparing them for the anything they may encounter in the next conflict January 2012[/FONT][FONT=Verdana][/FONT]







































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