Swedish police pic's

[Resurrection]

Btw, are there any pics of the NI assault on Schillerska during the riots? I've only been able to find a black and white one which shows a policeman with some kids face down on the ground.

[Thor]

Actually it's the other way around. This is the new way of doing things: a rational way.
The old 80's - early 90's way was "wildwest" as we like to call it.

Not around here, it has been the complete opposite. The old totally passive tactics from the 80's and 90's (and beyond) is being abandoned in more and more places and more "civila skyddsvakter" than ever is in service. It's not always a wish but a necessity. This is the natural response to a violent society and also due to the fact that security companies are doing more of the old style police work than ever.

Most of the security guards have piss poor training and lacks motivation to do their job, these are the people that are always looking for the easiest way out. Securitas wouldn't be doing security in Baghdad, and I don't think they should be doing that kind of thing here either with their current level of professionalism.

Just look at what in England a few days ago.. 50 million pounds lost? Jeez... Good job. Passive security is great but it's only part of the solution.

[Kaapeli]

Not around here, it has been the complete opposite. The old totally passive tactics from the 80's and 90's (and beyond) is being abandoned in more and more places and more "civila skyddsvakter" than ever is in service. It's not always a wish but a necessity.

Yes the security business is having a huge lift but that's even more because people are scared more than ever disproportionately to the actual threath.
There's been good research done on this atmosphere of fear.
But the laws and procedures regarding security work have been revised and the actions of security guards are being watched more closely than before. This means excess violence that was common before has been mostly rooted out, firearms and some other cowboy stuff put away and enforcing the feeling of security and crime prevention made priorities over rent-a-cop -mentality.

This is the natural response to a violent society and also due to the fact that security companies are doing more of the old style police work than ever.

Which is ofcourse wrong because security companies aren't meant or trained for that. Just look at the laws: only very slightly extended rights compared to civilians.
The violence is a problem yes but giving undertrained, underpaid and undermotivated personel guns won't solve that. Even cops are getting more non-lethal stuff and using less and less their guns and their personal security has been improved by what you would call "passive" procedures and equipment.
If you need more cops then you should get more of them. Not try to make security guards into them.

[QUOTE=Thor]Most of the security guards have piss poor training and lacks motivation to do their job, these are the people that are always looking for the easiest way out. Securitas wouldn't be doing security in Baghdad, and I don't think they should be doing that kind of thing here either with their current level of professionalism.[QUOTE=Thor]

Indeed. That is due to laws concerning private security in western countries and their role too. PMC's operating in high risk areas are a different business anyway left for paramilitary security companies.

Just look at what in England a few days ago.. 50 million pounds lost? Jeez... Good job. Passive security is great but it's only part of the solution.

There's nothing that guns would have helped in that situation. You'd only have dead people and those would propably be the guards and that poor guys family taken hostage.
And it looks like the security company messed up too somewhat: too much money in one place, insufficient planning and co-operation with the police in a forseeable crisis situation (kidnap and blackmail) and it looks like the money wasn't protected by color pellets or tagged with tracking devices. Next time they will be better prepared and hopefully avoid the next time competely.
But still the crime has mostly been solved already so we have an eventual success anyway with the least possible casualties.

People should understand that in security business the safety of the guard comes 99% of times before the safety of the object they're guarding (again not inluding bodyguard work and a couple of others but they're a minority). Guards have no obligation to risk their lives innecessarily unlike cops and soldiers.

[JunglistSoldier]

I'm a securityguard and I'd glady strap on a glock if they would let me. Then again I take my job seriously and have prior weapon/pistol experience from a previous position and I'm willing to train to maintain that level.

At my current position however, that won't happen. We arn't even allowd expandeble batons.

I'm all for arming securityguards. I think it's only part of the solution to have the cash destory itself and whatnot, I think a major part in this pussle is raising the bar for how well trained an armoured ar driver must be. weed out the weak and make sure that they learn evasive driving and firearms.

[Resurrection]

And what do you know... another money transport was robbed just an hour ago.

[Swedish Chef]

Thanks for the nice words, and the pic's, gents.

[Kaapeli]

I'm a securityguard and I'd glady strap on a glock if they would let me. Then again I take my job seriously and have prior weapon/pistol experience from a previous position and I'm willing to train to maintain that level.

And what are you guarding? The president?

At my current position however, that won't happen. We arn't even allowd expandeble batons..

I have a permit for that but don't carry one. I find the OC spray much more useful and effective as a deterrent and self defence weapon.
Guns I have no use for. If someone points a gun at me it's better to let him have what he wants than start playing a wildwest duel and propably get killed (I have military police gun training). Also nothing I guard is worth risking my life (a few thousand cash register euros or home appliances).

I'm all for arming securityguards. I think it's only part of the solution to have the cash destory itself and whatnot, I think a major part in this pussle is raising the bar for how well trained an armoured ar driver must be. weed out the weak and make sure that they learn evasive driving and firearms.

Drivings skills and armor is good (though covert civilian cars, irregular routes and schedules + tracking down information leaks would propably be safer).
But you really think it's a smart move to have a gunfight with criminals packing assault rifles and bombs and get killed for a two million euroes that the police will capture back anyway with the criminals too?
In this swedish case if those security guards had been armed they'd be dead by now. Two relatively inexperienced guys (or experienced for that matter, it's a lose-lose situation for very little gain) with hand guns sitting in a car trying to combat east european veterans armed with assault rifles over money... Madness I tell you and lots of dead security guards over nothing.

Even the police call the SWAT (or whatever is your local equivalent) when they're facing an armed guy or call backup when there's even a possibility that the criminal has a gun! You can't expect some security guards to start fighting back in a situation where even policemen call half the citys cops for support. Just look at those pictures of the swedish SWAT taking out a single guy to ensure maximum safety. That's just crazytalk from hollywood movies.

In Finland the entire police force fire their guns only around 5 times a year in a real life situation (these 5 cases includes shooting aggressive animals). I don't think it's that much different in Sweden where there's less violent crime per capita. It's unbelievable overkill to arm security guards with guns when even the police has so few uses of firearms (taser has replaced much of even that). And guns do cause risky situations just by being handled by humans.
Not worth it.
There's been only one killed security guard in FIinland after the war and even that was a situation where no gun could have saved him (he was stabbed so fast and suddenly). Again a passive vest and an OC spray could propably have.
Think about it.

[jerka71_1]

great photos are the swedish police the only agency with a tactical unit (Customs, corrections etc.)

Yep, they are!

[jerka71_1]

ok thanks i only asked because i found a photo on a website showing guys in masks holding a guy on the ground and the site said it was customs but i'd never been able to find it anywere else

http://www.svenskatullare.se/attack_001.jpg

Hmm.. Havn´t seen the pic before. It´s hard to see their origin. Could be Armed Forces just fooling around. I don´t know but I still certain to say that the customs don´t have any tactical unit!!

[jerka71_1]

my mistake reading the rest of the site its some sort of NBC exercise the guys a TULL officer

http://www.svenskatullare.se/

OK!............

[Parzival]

Hmm......
Aright. this is how it is.
There is a diffrence between Beväpnade ordningsvakter and Civila skyddsvakter. We do not need more Civilia skyddsvakter just to make sure the security.
what we need is more Beväpnade ordningsvakter and they are approved by the länsstyrelsen (State concil) . However, The security companies choose to be unarmed.

[Kaapeli]

Hmm......
Aright. this is how it is.
There is a diffrence between Beväpnade ordningsvakter and Civila skyddsvakter. We do not need more Civilia skyddsvakter just to make sure the security.
what we need is more Beväpnade ordningsvakter and they are approved by the länsstyrelsen (State concil) . However, The security companies choose to be unarmed.

Here in Finland we have väktare (5 days + 7 days) and ordningsvakter (2 days) training. Most guys who are patrolling high risk areas like the subway lines have both because a väktare can have better equipment by law (like extendable batons and gas sprays) and ordningsvakter have more rights to remove unwanted persons.
Then there's people who have one or the other license: Regular guards handle industrial guard duty where you're unlike to face violence and these public order guards work in bars as bouncers.

[Swedish Chef]

Armed escorts, police or others, are in no way guaranteed to stop these kind of robberies. Remember that the only unsolved murder of a police officer on duty in Sweden (that of Leif Widengren in Högdalen in Stockholm 1992) happened during just an escort of these transports.

So back to the pic's, same incident as the last bunch:



Photos: MIKAEL HELLSTEN

[Swedish Chef]

[Skyman]

Unitform and gear look awesome......!!!! Great photo