It would be nice if something like a big SADF resource center could be set up. Something interactive like the MSN Group...
My apologies for being a pedantic so-and-so. 8SAI (as far as I know) always retained the name 8SAI (eg. 1SAI, still Mech unit, still only 8SAI - not composite/multi-corps/attached unit). Reason for my "sensitivities" being that during the 61Bn closure and 8SAI amalgamation it was proposed to rename 8SAI to 8Mech to accomodate both units' names. I rather liked this idea. The powers that be did not. 8SAI is now a Mech unit and are currently deployed.Originally Posted by Clint_Durban
So 8SAI is still mechanised? We were having a debate here a while back regarding which units were still mechanised and popular opinion was that 1SAI is our only remaining mechanised unit.
I thought 4SAI and 8SAI were also mechanised but people seemed to think that they'd reverted back to being motorised.
If you can say, which units are mchanised?
No, I probably can't say, but the Dept of Defence can:
(see page 39 onwards)(not PDF pages, but pages in doc itself)
http://www.dod.mil.za/documents/stra...plan06to09.pdf
Seeing as info is in public domain.
1SAI and 8SAI are SANDF regular (PF) Mech Bns.
There are also (according to the above plan) 4 Reserve Mech Bns (ACR).
Glad we've finally sorted this out ! Thanks exT70!
I thought you'd be as happy as me. I think we both kinda went away scratching our heads at not having found a definative answer.
Having read the PDF now and done some other searches it would seem 8 SAI was motorised for a while (certainly in the 1997/98 timeframe) but will now (or has fairly recently) become mechanised, taking over from 61 Mech. The PDF says "61 Mech Bn (must reorganise at Upington)", after "1 SAI Bn" and before "four Mech Inf Bns (Reserve Force)". So will 8 SAI retain its name or become the "new" 61 Mech?
8SAI stays 8SAI. The 8Mech idea was not excepted. Pretty much the whole of 61 moved to Upington (8SAI now commanded by ex-61 OC) and the reasons for and behind the closure of 61 and move to Upington would be a thread on its own.
As with 1SAI, the 8SAI name is correct. The old "Mech" designation as in 61 and 62Mech of old would not be correct today. The current "Mech" Bns are "pure" Inf Bns, and not the composite Mech Bns of old. Hence "SAI". No armour, art etc. are permenently/semi-permanently attached anymore. Last "combined" (with different Corps being attached) force I can remember is "Skeleton Force" of Lohatla/CTC of old.
I suppose that kind of force (61 Mech-like) could be put together for ops with a few months training, from elements of 1 SAI, 8 SAI, 1SSB, 1 SA Tank Regt and 4 Arty Regt. Does a mech bn include Ratel-90s and ZT-3s? Although losing the habitual working of combined-arms battle groups is not a good thing IMHO. The army does seem a bit unbalanced though. When are eight motorised infantry battalions going to be needed? Surely four or five would be enough, even with peacekeeping commitments?
Total infantry (regular force) is now 14 battalions (2 mech, 1 para, 1 airmobile, 8 motorised, 3 light).
Armour (reg force)- 1 tank regt, 1 armoured recce regt
Artillery (reg force)- 1 regiment (combined field/rocket/mortar)
Ratel 90 is part of Atk Pl in Supt Coy of Inf Bn and accordingly a SAIC weapon. ZT-3 (or whatever its called now) in a SAAC weapon (though it should probably also be part of the SAIC and specifically in the Atk Pl).
The current "balance" of the army is almost immaterial. Everybody in all the overstretched Bns are doing the same peacekeeping duties, which mostly to date entails MOT work. And the emphysis shall be where the money is being spent and troops utilised, being peacekeeping. Guess what plays second fiddle? Conventional warfare.
Yes I suppose it's inevitable.
Re: anti-tanks; that document mentions AT missiles as part of an armoured car regt, which in the reg force is 1SSB. I assume Ratel-90s are in mech inf bns only while the others have the 106mm recoilless.
I doubt whether too much ZT3 work is being done at present. The toys cost-a-plenty and I hazzard a guess only a very small numbers will be in service (if any).
Correct re Ratel 90 (Mech) and 106 (Mot) mounted on Caspirs. Atk Pl (Mech & Mot) are also supposed to have tank hunting team. Years ago they were equiped with Milan, but systems were withdrawn many moons ago (cost of toys again). Have seen reports in media that Milan might/has been purchased again. Same existing withdrawn launchers, new generation missles. Atk Pl would now have to use RPGs as per a normal Pl (RPG now standard Pl weapon).
Wow...the SADF, by becoming the SANDF, really became small.
There is also the stereotype that the effeciency is lower than before 1994. Is it right or wrong stereotype?
What happens to any Defence Force when the war ends and no new threat takes it place??
And you get rid of a very large proportion of you combat-experienced and/or capable staff??
And politics take over (and in this I am incorrect - any organisation of any size has "politics" of some sort/manner/form involved - this was the case in the SADF and still so with the SANDF - the rest is up to your own interpretation)
Something sort of newish. For those with a propensity for jumping out of perfectly serviceable aircraft.
SANDF Gecko as to be used/used by both Parabats and Airlanded. I don’t know whether it is to replace the Jackal or be used in conjunction with it.
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