Waffen SS troops

**Bachelor** · 01-04-2008

**Jarhead** · 01-04-2008

Originally Posted by Bachelor

The founder takes a dogtag as a souvenir..

....thats it...there are a so many soldiers that cant get identified because of the missing dogtags...
My grandfather wasnt found yet, over 62 years since the end of ww 2.
Thats just one exmaple.

**Karo** · 01-04-2008

Originally Posted by Bachelor

Angry for what? It is not reasonably. Now old dogtags are necessary to anybody(The official organisations). When somebody finds a dogtag that it does its x-copy and the information on the place where is found, the burial place (if find with a body) and the information about founder. All documents send in the Ministry of Defence. If it is a German dogtag that all information it is transferred in German Embassy in Moscow. The Ministry of Defence (Russian or Germany) pays for it money. Dogtags are not necessary. The founder takes a dogtag as a souvenir. It is the official policy. The relative of the victim can ask a dogtag but it happens seldom. Nobody destroys tombs. In war buried anywhere. Now bury on a cemetery. Usually bodies of German soldiers return in Germany. Relatives can come to the tomb on cemetery.

Sorry... WHAT? Could you write your thoughts again in a proper english, please?

But i have to second the oppinion of Jarhead. Im getting sick seeing those dogtags robbed from the battlefield selled on ebay or anywhere else - without informing any relatives/appropriate authority. Also in my family there are persons with an unknown destiny like the grandfather of Jarhead.

**Hutz** · 01-04-2008

Didn't realize that many German dog tags were available on Ebay. A little disturbing.

**Karo** · 01-04-2008

Originally Posted by Rotorhead

Didn't realize that many German dog tags were available on Ebay. A little disturbing.

On the German Ebay they prohibited to sell them some time ago, but i guess on other countrys Ebay sites there are still some German dogtags selled..

**oregongrunt** · 01-04-2008

Originally Posted by Karo

Sorry... WHAT? Could you write your thoughts again in a proper english, please?

But i have to second the oppinion of Jarhead. Im getting sick seeing those dogtags robbed from the battlefield selled on ebay or anywhere else - without informing any relatives/appropriate authority. Also in my family there are persons with an unknown destiny like the grandfather of Jarhead.

I understand how you feel. I've seen ground dug German dogtags for sell in Ukrainian markets. I assumed they just dug up the bodies, stripped them, and left them. There was even an old helmet that still had the remains of someone's hair in it. When I asked a few locals about these things, they said that since they were from the fascists, noone cared!

**theholeinthedonut** · 01-04-2008

Originally Posted by Karo

Sorry... WHAT? Could you write your thoughts again in a proper english, please?

But i have to second the oppinion of Jarhead. Im getting sick seeing those dogtags robbed from the battlefield selled on ebay or anywhere else - without informing any relatives/appropriate authority. Also in my family there are persons with an unknown destiny like the grandfather of Jarhead.

X2 ....................

**Bachelor** · 01-04-2008

Sorry for my bad English. I think sense of my information people understand.
My grandfather was killed on war2 too. I have learnt only that my grandfather went in the military column on road. It was in Ukraine. German planes Junkers-87attacked by machine guns and bombs grandfather's column. My grandfather has been mortally wounded in a stomach. Soldiers of unit have buried him near the road. Relatives had received only the official notice of death. Nobody remembers this road. So many people was killed. Who buried bodes, others could buried them on the next day. Nobody knows grandfather's places of burial till now. We haven't grandfather's things like dogtag, medals, some...
Only normal and civilized people can do correctly. If they have found a dogtag they have inform the Government organization. We have also bad-stupid people. They are live in all countries. There are embittered people. Not many but have... Fascists have killed a lot of civil in the USSR. The Soviet people did not invite fascists. Fascists have come to kill and killed. Fascists have killed many Ukrainians. Many Ukrainians do not know where their relatives are buried. If you think that embittered people will bury bodies of German with honors you are mistaken. Therefore and such bad relation to aggressors. They hate aggressors and murderers of their relatives and compatriots. I understand Ukrainians... But the majority of normal people does correctly. They understand all situation of war. Now we have problems with burial places of the Soviet soldiers in Poland, Czech, Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia... Tombs collapse, profaned by vandals. Many rus soldiers MIA in Poland, Czech.., other countries... And more and of simply people in ex-USSR become embittered. It is the dirty policy and stupid people. But we must think.
I live in Russia. My friend has work in the organization on search of the lost soldiers in that war. He was military man, retired now. He doing work very good. They receive money from the government. Government have section for control and work in this problem. In winter they work in archives and summer in forests-fields. Many simply people help. When bodies of soldiers were found by casually simple people. They inform police. The police causes military men. Military men come. They check the weapon and an explosive. But in any case the military Office of Public Prosecutor checks bodies and things. Like CSI. It a low. I know lot of the facts of founded of bodies of German soldiers. My friend told. Military experts did criminal examination and relatives took away bodies. I can tell that our military men from the Ministry of Defense of Russia concern to all lost soldiers with honors. It better to return bodies to home. I think relatives should have the tomb nearby and know the place where he was killed.
I don't know situation in Ukraine.
And for the information... More than half of all subjects on sale the counterfeit. These are signs, crosses, uniform, daggers... It made of newday-today. It not originals. But there are made very qualitatively and looks like old... German ammunitions have high price and lot of experts and factories does this business.

**Bachelor** · 01-04-2008

Originally Posted by Karo

Sorry... WHAT? Could you write your thoughts again in a proper english, please?

But i have to second the oppinion of Jarhead. Im getting sick seeing those dogtags robbed from the battlefield selled on ebay or anywhere else - without informing any relatives/appropriate authority. Also in my family there are persons with an unknown destiny like the grandfather of Jarhead.

Sorry for my bad English. Second Attempt.
Angry for what? It is not reasonably. The official organizations of Russia-Germany don't interesting of old dogtags or old personal things of victim. When somebody finds a dogtag that it does its x-copy and the information on the place where is found, the burial place (if find with a body) and the information about finder. All documents send in the Ministry of Defence. We don't do that long way. We have Military Commandant's office or Military commissariat in Russia in all city. The finder must go in it office. They will make all under the law. Also will pay expenses to finder. If it is a German dogtag that all information it is transferred in German Embassy in Moscow. The Ministry of Defence (Russian or Germany) pays for it money. Dogtags like a Thing not necessary. The finder takes a dogtag as a souvenir. It is officially authorised. It is the official policy of German and Russian MinDf. It is legal business. They sell dogtabs to pay other works for search-dig. The Government spend not so big many for this work. Public organizations and private selectors-finders are compelled to sell historical thinks. Sotheby, antic do that too...
The relative of the victim can ask a dogtag but it happens seldom. Usually ask personal things. The finder is obliged to return found only to relatives of soldier. Nobody destroys tombs. In war buried anywhere in forests, on fields, near roads... Usually bodies of German soldiers return in Germany. Relatives can come to the tomb on cemetery. Like the Soviet soldiers return to relatives and return to home.
We should be angry with those who takes away things-ammunitions but does not inform about bodies. In Russia them name "Black diggers". They are searched by militia-police and all normal people. But they is work...

**Karo** · 01-04-2008

(I dont understand everything you have written but i guess i got the most things.)

I was talking about the people who dig for "militaria stuff" on former battlefields only to get a bit money and dont care about the corpses they may find. (like the "black diggers" you said) So the official "seekers" find only the bones and arent aible to identify the corpses which might had been possible if the robbers wouldnt take things like dogtags etc away. Its clear that this isnt tolerated by the Russian governement (at leats it should be) and not everybody is so careless about the past, but there are some people out there who are just interested in the money they make with the stuff and thats what I condem. But as I see that you had also have some hard destinies in your family during the war, i think that we in general understand each other.

**Jarhead** · 01-04-2008

thanks for your support Kamerad

**Karo** · 01-04-2008

No Problem.

**Bachelor** · 01-05-2008

Originally Posted by Karo

(I dont understand everything you have written but i guess i got the most things.)

I was talking about the people who dig for "militaria stuff" on former battlefields only to get a bit money and dont care about the corpses they may find. (like the "black diggers" you said) So the official "seekers" find only the bones and arent aible to identify the corpses which might had been possible if the robbers wouldnt take things like dogtags etc away. Its clear that this isnt tolerated by the Russian governement (at leats it should be) and not everybody is so careless about the past, but there are some people out there who are just interested in the money they make with the stuff and thats what I condem. But as I see that you had also have some hard destinies in your family during the war, i think that we in general understand each other.

**Bachelor** · 01-07-2008

**Observer58** · 01-09-2008

Originally Posted by Canuck Farrier

Ya there is some awesome photos!Thanks

Hi Everybody, this is my first post here, I have just found this site searching about the Battle for Berlin, and the photos I could see here are amazing. I am not a reaaly expert about WWII, but I have a doubt and I would like to check with you guys if you can help me with this matter.

Why the German POWs were kept prisioner, mainly in Russia, for such a long time? Most part,or the portion which survived were realeased just in 1955. At that point of time Germany did not make any request for the release of those soldiers? The interneational comunity just forgot those men in URSS?

I am sorry if this matter should be entered in other section, if it is true please accept my appologize.

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