TNI in Gallery (the New Photos)

[Ominae]

it is said on the article, SP-1 (senapan panjang-1/ Long riffle-1) was use as standart infantri riffle.. SP-1 was a modification from Baretta BM-59MK1, cal 7,62X51mm.

Pindad produce around 50,000 of them. and then, the riffle developed into SP-2 and SP-3. TNI use those riffle on East Timor Ops during 70's. but the result was so bad. there were a lot of problem...

and then Pindad decide to design their own assault riffle on 1976. the riffle called SS-77, cal 5,56NATO. the design was based on AR-18, with rotating bolt and gas operated mechanism.. the SS-77 also being developed as SS-79 with larger calibre, 7,62 NATO.

but the SS-77 and SS-79 Never enter mass production or being use as standar Infantri assault riffle. because the developing of the riffle will cost a lot of money and budget. so, Indonesia Govt decide to buy a license...

Wasn't it called Bandung Weapons Factory for Pindad before? What kinds of problems for the SP rifles? Jamming based from the modification to suit the tropic region?

PS - What's the difference between SP-2 and SP-3?

[McAssoy]

something to read...

should one of you tell me the difference between LPD and LST please...
sorry, newbie just want to know...
or LPD is more similiar to an helo carrier..?

[garandman]

I was trying to figure out what are those sticky stuffs.. gotta be lacquer, but I didn't shoot any steel cased ammo. I brushed the damn thing for a good 20 minutes.. I probably will have to snake the gas tube.

I wouldnt know anything about BFA and fouling... I never served So do you have a case of M855?

Does any of those ammo you shot have neck sealant? Lacquer from the neck sealant could leave residue in the chamber as well.

I used up my stash of SS109 long time ago. It was my practice ammo. Then they got expensive, so I started reloading. I used to shoot NRA service rifle competition several years ago. So my style of shooting and practice did not take too much ammo. Now I have resorted to shooting 22LR with conversion kit out of my AR to keep the cost down. Hell, I have not fired any 223 since last November when I took down a doe using an A2 with iron sight only.

Never served myself. Just been around ROTC training to see lots of blanks being fired.

[garandman]

Wasn't it called Bandung Weapons Factory for Pindad before? What kinds of problems for the SP rifles? Jamming based from the modification to suit the tropic region?

PS - What's the difference between SP-2 and SP-3?

Not a first hand account, but I have a friend who has served as freelance consultant to both Pindad and TNI on small arms issues who told me that the SP rifles were plagued with manufacturing and training issues. The parts consistency on the SP rifles from Pindad were not that good. SP is a derivative of an M1 Garand, so parts quality is critical. Trigger group falling off a rifle during use is one of the symptoms of loose fitting parts.

But not all the soldiers who carried the rifles during E. Timor operation received adequate training either. For example .... there were stories about gas plug flying off the front end of a gas cylinder on an SP1 during combat. I commented that keeping the gas plug tightened is the most important thing to keep the M1 operational. Since the SP was a derivative of the M1 I thought a loose gas plug was a known field maintenance that a soldier must do at all time. That's why they include a tool set in the buttstock of an M1. Then my friend chimed in saying .... yeah, the SP1 also came with the same tool, but many soldiers did not even know how to use the tool, or that the rifle even came with one.

I wish I could get my hand on a Pindad's SP1 .... would make a nice addition to my M1 collection.

[toukairin]

mr G, i have some pics of the SP-2. It's from the inventory of PUSDIKPENGMILUM (Pusat Pendidikan Pengajar Militer Umum/General Military Instructor Education Centre), located at Cimahi, West Java. My unit (1st Batt., Student Regiment Mahawarman) use them as "senjata pegangan" (lit. : weapon-to-hold).

Links :




Oh, bonus for you : a nightmare (kan tidak boleh dibalik di lantai hahaha!)

[Ominae]

Not a first hand account, but I have a friend who has served as freelance consultant to both Pindad and TNI on small arms issues who told me that the SP rifles were plagued with manufacturing and training issues. The parts consistency on the SP rifles from Pindad were not that good. SP is a derivative of an M1 Garand, so parts quality is critical. Trigger group falling off a rifle during use is one of the symptoms of loose fitting parts.

But not all the soldiers who carried the rifles during E. Timor operation received adequate training either. For example .... there were stories about gas plug flying off the front end of a gas cylinder on an SP1 during combat. I commented that keeping the gas plug tightened is the most important thing to keep the M1 operational. Since the SP was a derivative of the M1 I thought a loose gas plug was a known field maintenance that a soldier must do at all time. That's why they include a tool set in the buttstock of an M1. Then my friend chimed in saying .... yeah, the SP1 also came with the same tool, but many soldiers did not even know how to use the tool, or that the rifle even came with one.

I wish I could get my hand on a Pindad's SP1 .... would make a nice addition to my M1 collection.

Thanks. Looks like constant maintenance was a bigger problem than loose parts.

Did Pindad create the SP rifles at the Bandung Weapons Factory?

Oh yeah, is the SP-2 and SP-3 different by the buttstock mainly? Seems the SP-3 is meant to be a light support weapon? Not sure what role the SP-2 does.

[toukairin]

@ominae
I think what differs the SP-1 and SP-2 is that the SP-2 by default has a foldable sight for rifle-grenade launcher, CMIIW.

SP-3, as you can see, has a pistol-grip. The SP-1 and 2 aren't.

[Ominae]

Thanks. Wanted to clarify on whether the SP-3's meant to be a LSW.

Does Bandung have Pindad-affiliated weapons factory under Pindad?

[Kopassus]

should one of you tell me the difference between LPD and LST please...
sorry, newbie just want to know...
or LPD is more similiar to an helo carrier..?

Thanks!


Landing Ship, Tank (LST) was the military designation for naval vessels created during World War II to support amphibious operations by carrying significant quantities of vehicles, cargo, and landing troops directly onto an unimproved shore. Mostly around 100 meters, but always smaller than 115 m.
Example: Kelas Teluk Semangka 512 LST

An amphibious transport dock (also called a landing platform dock or LPD) is an amphibious warfare ship, a warship that embarks, transports, and lands elements of a landing force for expeditionary warfare missions. The ships are generally designed to transport troops into a war zone by sea, primarily using landing craft, although invariably they also have the capability to operate transport helicopters.
Amphibious transport docks perform the mission of amphibious transports, amphibious cargo ships, and the older LPDs by incorporating both a flight deck and a well deck that can be ballasted and deballasted to support landing craft or amphibious vehicles. Are normally bigger than LSTs.
Nice example: The KRI Soeharso 990 (formally KRI Tanjung Dalpele 972) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KRI_Tanjung_Dalpele

Landing Helicopter Dock (LHD) are even more bigger but they look like mini aircraft carriers.

Indonesian made Tigre model, looks really good:

(Taken from Detik.com)

Can anyone confirm this:
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums...d.php?t=155318
"Pro-West Papuan separatists reported to have downed an Indonesian C-130 Hercules " Sounds like bull....
Nothing about it on Indonesian news sites or BBCnews.com

[garandman]

mr G, i have some pics of the SP-2. It's from the inventory of PUSDIKPENGMILUM (Pusat Pendidikan Pengajar Militer Umum/General Military Instructor Education Centre), located at Cimahi, West Java. My unit (1st Batt., Student Regiment Mahawarman) use them as "senjata pegangan" (lit. : weapon-to-hold).

Links :

[Gunny_Ermey]HALT !!!! Finger off trigger you maggot!! Now get down and give me 20 !![/Gunny_Ermey]

Oh, bonus for you : a nightmare (kan tidak boleh dibalik di lantai hahaha!)

Is this a revenge?
Did Pak ZA tell you to do this as a retaliation for causing him to becoming unconscious and drooling uncontrollably after I posted the photos of my collection? You guys are cruel! What did these rifles ever do to you? I hope you get the rear aperture all the way down before torturing these rifles against the floor this way. Poor rifles ...

I wish someday I could have Pindad made rifles and pistols in my collection ..

[TheBroncos]

Can anyone confirm this:
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums...d.php?t=155318
"Pro-West Papuan separatists reported to have downed an Indonesian C-130 Hercules " Sounds like bull....
Nothing about it on Indonesian news sites or BBCnews.com[/QUOTE]

http://www.rnzi.com/pages/news.php?op=read&id=45936

The story has not been picked up by any other outlet.

[Ominae]

Don't know. Seems that no other news site has picked it up.

PS - Seems the SS-1 had been exported to Nigeria. Can someone with Indonesian fluency correct me if I'm wrong based from the article. And yeah, need someone to help me confirm if there's info that Pindad created the SP-1 from its Bandung factory?

[karbol]

Can anyone confirm this:
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums...d.php?t=155318
"Pro-West Papuan separatists reported to have downed an Indonesian C-130 Hercules " Sounds like bull....
Nothing about it on Indonesian news sites or BBCnews.com

http://www.rnzi.com/pages/news.php?op=read&id=45936

The story has not been picked up by any other outlet.[/quote]

it's not true... i know for sure...

http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2...-continue.html

[karbol]

PS - Seems the SS-1 had been exported to Nigeria. Can someone with Indonesian fluency correct me if I'm wrong based from the article. And yeah, need someone to help me confirm if there's info that Pindad created the SP-1 from its Bandung factory?

based on the article, yes. Pindad exported SS-1 to nigeria...

and yes, SP-1 was created from Bandung. and old name of Pindad was Pabrik Senjata dan Mesiu...

[toukairin]

[Gunny_Ermey]HALT !!!! Finger off trigger you maggot!! Now get down and give me 20 !![/Gunny_Ermey]



Is this a revenge?
Did Pak ZA tell you to do this as a retaliation for causing him to becoming unconscious and drooling uncontrollably after I posted the photos of my collection? You guys are cruel! What did these rifles ever do to you? I hope you get the rear aperture all the way down before torturing these rifles against the floor this way. Poor rifles ...

I wish someday I could have Pindad made rifles and pistols in my collection ..

haha, i'll tell the kids later about the finger off trigger. But whenever i see them holding an airsoft rifle, i'd always tell them to put their finger off the trigger... treat it like a real firearm, so that whenever you're holding a real one, nobody would risk getting hurt or killed because of your damn finger!

hahaha, nonono, it's as usual : it's how the lecturers/trainer/GUMIL taught them to put the rifle on the floor... maybe the Army thinks that "hey this gun ain't used anymore, might as well treat them like a big stick!"