Reply With Quotenah I live in a cityOriginally Posted by Javaa
extra chinooks, 1 dc10, 2 c130's, bvs10 Viking, Boxer, CV90, Alladin mini UAV were all decided on by mister Kamp
on the other hand
4 M frigates, all B105 Bolkows and P3C Orions, a number of F16's, Leopard2's and pzh2000's and more were sold/scrapped
I like the guy personally he seems well involved with the troops but I hate what the government did to the military
nah I live in a city
And he closed down Twente Airport. I live next to it and totally loved that fvcking airport and the sound of the airplanes flying over
But indeed Kamp tries to do the best. He knows it's impossible to do everything, because there's not enough money. So the most important things have to be done. And sadly enough twente airport and the L and M frigats were not the most important. Besides we got 4 LCF's which are much better than the M and L frigates anyway.
The operational units like the Marine Corps need the money now. That's where we're heading; to infantry and light armor units for global operations. The Marine Corps will get it's second support ship in the form of a second LPD (sistership of the Hr.Ms. Rotterdam) and new choppers (NH90) will improve the airlifting capabilities of the Marine Corps. The Bsv10 Viking will finally provide the RNLMC with an armored all-terrain vehicle. The only really major thing left on the RNLMC most-wanted-list is a light armored patrol vehicle like a light armored jeep. The unarmored laro's is like driving a fvcking golfkart into battle.
The Army is getting the Fennek and the Boxer which will replace a number of vehicles. The Boxer is still a bit uncertain though, since there were a few price-issues. These vehicles are a great addition to the arsenal and are a real improvement compared to the YPR's they'll replace.
We don't really use the leo's anyway and the Pzh2000 is really great, but we don't need that many of them. So I don't really care about selling a few of them. Improve the remaining leo's and buy more stuff that is really needed (don't forget personal gear like new armor, boots, vests, goggles ect).
it's the sound of freedomAnd he closed down Twente Airport. I live next to it and totally loved that fvcking airport and the sound of the airplanes flying over
but I don't really care about bases, I think closing a number of bases was the smartest thing he did, saves a crapload of money and since there's no war looming on the horizon we don't really need to spread our military around the country anyways, they can close them all down imo save for a handfull of superbases
I'd rather see them close camps down then units (and valuable skillsets)
The LCF's replaced the L frigates but the M frigates are really a totally different thing, you can't replace them with LCF's (or patrolboats for that matter unless they decide on those c00l sigma corvettesBut indeed Kamp tries to do the best. He knows it's impossible to do everything, because there's not enough money. So the most important things have to be done. And sadly enough twente airport and the L and M frigats were not the most important. Besides we got 4 LCF's which are much better than the M and L frigates anyway.
wel up untill 1995 we said the same thing about the F16, never used them so we should get rid of them, we should not place our eggs in one basketThe operational units like the Marine Corps need the money now. That's where we're heading; to infantry and light armor units for global operations. The Marine Corps will get it's second support ship in the form of a second LPD (sistership of the Hr.Ms. Rotterdam) and new choppers (NH90) will improve the airlifting capabilities of the Marine Corps. The Bsv10 Viking will finally provide the RNLMC with an armored all-terrain vehicle. The only really major thing left on the RNLMC most-wanted-list is a light armored patrol vehicle like a light armored jeep. The unarmored laro's is like driving a fvcking golfkart into battle.
The Army is getting the Fennek and the Boxer which will replace a number of vehicles. The Boxer is still a bit uncertain though, since there were a few price-issues. These vehicles are a great addition to the arsenal and are a real improvement compared to the YPR's they'll replace.
We don't really use the leo's anyway and the Pzh2000 is really great, but we don't need that many of them. So I don't really care about selling a few of them. Improve the remaining leo's and buy more stuff that is really needed (don't forget personal gear like new armor, boots, vests, goggles ect).
who knows maybe next year we'll start using main battle tanks I don't know
The LCF has MUCH more firepower than a regular L-frigat. In terms of firepower the LCF could be classified as destroyers, but since the size of the ship is too small it can't be classified as a destroyer and now it's a frigat. So replacing the M-frigates with LCF's is not really a problem. You must understand that the old L-frigates had no cannon. They were really just for airdefense (although they did have harpoon-missiles against other ships). The M-frigates had everything (hence the "multi-purpose"). The LCF also has everything: air-defense and surface to surface including a 127mm canon which is much heavier than the 76mm on the M-frigats. So in terms of weaponary the LCF is a mix of the L and M frigat and better than both.The LCF's replaced the L frigates but the M frigates are really a totally different thing, you can't replace them with LCF's (or patrolboats for that matter unless they decide on those c00l sigma corvettes
wel up untill 1995 we said the same thing about the F16, never used them so we should get rid of them, we should not place our eggs in one basket
who knows maybe next year we'll start using main battle tanks I don't know
And I didn't say we should scrap all MBT's. But I don't mind selling a few if it means we can upgrade the other ones to a higher standard and invest in the Fennek and Boxer vehicles.
yeah that's the problem ... using an LCF for a naval blockade or patrol and escort work seems a bit overkill to me
yeah I knowAnd I didn't say we should scrap all MBT's. But I don't mind selling a few if it means we can upgrade the other ones to a higher standard and invest in the Fennek and Boxer vehicles.
I just don't like the whole 'we don't use them anyways' argument
in the end we should just start spending more money on our military
SP2C for president
Look, I too would like our country to spend more money on the military and Kamp and Berlijn both say we should, but unfortunately they are not the ones that decide these things. And the arrgumant about us not using the Leo's. Unfortunately it's true. I would have loved seeing them in Iraq, but they weren't really needed there and in Afghanistan the mountaineous terrain makes them useless. So if you need to choose between keeping all leo's or selling a few and buy light armor that we do use, than I'll choose the latter. But of course it would be better if we didn't have to choose and buy light armor and keep all the leo's.
btw;
What's wrong with overkill? That's the way I like it. Playing fair is not my game
imo Al Muthanna didn't need Dutch troops at all we should've deployed to Basra or even further down the road with all our pretty toysSP2C for president
Look, I too would like our country to spend more money on the military and Kamp and Berlijn both say we should, but unfortunately they are not the ones that decide these things. And the arrgumant about us not using the Leo's. Unfortunately it's true. I would have loved seeing them in Iraq, but they weren't really needed there and in Afghanistan the mountaineous terrain makes them useless. So if you need to choose between keeping all leo's or selling a few and buy light armor that we do use, than I'll choose the latter. But of course it would be better if we didn't have to choose and buy light armor and keep all the leo's.
that was like sending a police swat team to stand outside a night club checking people for sportschoenen
it was embarrassing
I don't think we should even be tailoring our military around peacekeeping at all, it's primary job is the defence of our territories, overseas deployments are a bonus.
I don't like the whole push for light armour because it's basically only usefull for light duties, but when there's a real war on we'd have to rely on others to duke it out
hell we should get the ministry of foreign affairs to pay peacekeeping costs
true that!btw;
What's wrong with overkill? That's the way I like it. Playing fair is not my game
but it's expensive, a hopeless waste of valuable resources
Hehe well unfortunately I can recall the days with the old harness and rucksack. Hell, I had to wait more than a year before the bilaminate parka was issued, that was bad.
But anyway, it just makes me wonder why the didn't put a bit more effort in the belt, it leaves the backpack just not perfect.
The old backpack had 1 big advantage. Since it was so tiny you could not carry too much with you, but now with the 55ltr people try to take as much as possible with them. Must be a Dutch thing haha.
Fortunately enough my backpack is going where it belongs; in the storage room of my Leo, I'm heading for the tank platoon commanders course in Amersfoort after the holidays. (already been a loader and driver.)
How! The expeditionary nature of the modern military has to do with the modern type of small conflicts. It's not about peace-keeping. Afghanistan has little to do with peace-keeping, although I must admit it's the first major mission of it's kind for the modern dutch military. Note that I say 'major' since there have been smaller (covert) combat operations, but those only involve a small number of men and more in the SOF-type of mission than regular military.
The primary job of our military is protecting our territories , our civilans and our country's interest, both here and overseas. So overseas deployments are not a bonus. What we do in Afghanistan prevents terrorists from taking over again and thus helps in the fight against terrorist that might target our country, so it's a form of protecting our territories.
Light armor is needed, because heavy armor can't be used everywhere. Narrow streets of towns and mountaineous terrain call for lighter armor. Right now we only have heavy armor, YPR's and the heavy Patria. All unsuited for the job. The BsV10 Viking is a very welcome addition. For patrol duties in populated area's where you want to have contact with the locals you'll also need light armored vehicles instead of a heavy tank rumbling down the street. The alternative for the tank or heavy patria right now is the unarmoured jeep.
yeah I don't buy it, ISAF is peacekeeping imho, it is exactly the same mission as SFIR, except it's in a hotter area
don't get me wrong preventing terrorrists to take over Afghanistan again is a just cause and I'm all for it but it's not in our national interest, we have virtually no civilians in the country nor do we have any economical or even military interests in the region and if we want to use our military to prevent terrorist attacks then we should let the 13th mechanized battallion patrol downtown Amsterdam
sure it's needed but it can't be a substitute for heavy armour you can't replace a Leopard with a viking and if we can't afford that then we should not be doing multiple overseas missions at one time or even none at allLight armor is needed, because heavy armor can't be used everywhere. Narrow streets of towns and mountaineous terrain call for lighter armor. Right now we only have heavy armor, YPR's and the heavy Patria. All unsuited for the job. The BsV10 Viking is a very welcome addition. For patrol duties in populated area's where you want to have contact with the locals you'll also need light armored vehicles instead of a heavy tank rumbling down the street. The alternative for the tank or heavy patria right now is the unarmoured jeep.
Does enyone have pictures of the BsV10 Viking, I tried searching on a couple of military sites but nothing comes up.
And too bad they don't have a photosite for our TFU like with NLDET Irak had.
is this of any use? http://www.haborumuveszete.hu/rovato...vs-10_holland/
Yup thanks, I think my friend took a picture of one of those during the Vlootdagen. I was wondering what it was.
Hey all.. back from Holiday, found some pics. Enjoy!
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