I don’t know. The proper use of insignia has become a major topic of forum debates. This case is a bit tricky because the same people that have Recon insignia apparently have the VDV insignia on the other sleeve, or so it seems. There might be a number of explanations, apart from the conclusion that these are not VDV but rather the Army Recon units.Originally Posted by Kawai
- GRU originally trained at Ryazan VDV academy, and did adopt VDV uniform. This might explain why they have VDV and Recon insignia. But I doubt that this explanation is the correct one, since GRU spetsnaz is not subordinate to VDV command.
- VDV does have a VDV Recon – the 45th ORP VDV. So the individuals present who have the Recon insignia on the right sleeve, might be VDV Recon. However, the 45th ORP has its own insignia, which is nowhere in sight.
- The last version is that these units represent the reformed VDV structure. As you might know VDV has been undergoing reformation, which, in part, includes reinforcing of the battalions with recon platoons, and regiments with recon companies.
Since I have started posting on VDV, I'll add a few more pics on the subject.
If you a talking about the Bat it’s a symbol of intelligence / reconnaissance of any kind, it’s not reserved only for Army reconnaissance units.
GRU didn’t train in Ryazan per se. There was a special company from where a lot of fresh officers would receive orders to Spetsnaz GRU. No connection to the uniform.
On the photos Maksim posted you can see 45 ORP.
VDV had regimental recon companies since Soviet times, the Divisions as well have separate recon companies - ORR.
In conclusion on the pictures you can see either regimental recon company or Divisional ORR.
My Respect to Gagarin, opened a new Era for the whole mankind, was at his crash site quiet a few times to Salute a True Hero with a toast.
Vdv .......
That's what I thought as well. What seemed strange is to have two rather general insignia on both sleeves. According to the latest regulations, I believe one sleeve (left?) is reserved for identification of regiment. Although I might be mistaken.
I agree. Future GRU trained at Ryazan, just like future engineers train in engineering schools. Here are some words of Kozlov on this subject:
"Факультет специальной разведки был создан в Рязанском воздушно-десантном училище в 1968 году. Из состава восьми рот курсантов были набраны первые курсанты -будущие офицеры спецназа ГРУ... Десантное училище как нельзя лучше подходило для того, чтобы в его состав вошел такой факультет, поскольку спецназовцы форму носили десантную, также, как и десантники совершали прыжки с парашютом, и поэтому не выделялись из общей массы курсантов. Однако по-прежнему ни в одном из проспектов, рассказывающих о правилах поступления в училище ни слова не было сказано о наличии в училище факультета спецразведки, который по большому счету подчинялся ГРУ."
Source: http://www.agentura.ru/library/spetsnaz50/kuznica/
Perhaps you are right. They certainly did have recon. I will confine myself to quoting Alexander Kolmakov, the head of VDV:
"Еще одно значительное изменение в структуре войск, о котором стоит сказать особо - увеличение доли разведподразделений. Основной тактической единицей в современной войне становится батальон, но своих разведчиков не в парашютно-десантном, не в мотострелковом батальоне нет. А воевать без разведки невозможно. В Чечне, чтобы решить эту проблему в батальонах создавались нештатные разведвзвода. Разведывательные задачи решались, но при этом выхолащивался, редел боевой порядок батальона. В новой структуре ВДВ все будет уже готово к боевому применению. В дивизиях и батальонах появятся дополнительные разведывательные подразделения... Также при существующей ныне структуре ничего нет и у командира батальона, все в ротах. Теперь же он получит разведывательный взвод, а в десантно-штурмовых и горных батальонах еще и свою артиллерию."
Source: http://www.bratishka.ru/archiv/2005/8/2005_8_1.php
can you post that info in English?
great Sprut and BMd-4 pics, thanks you.
Sorry C.Pontius. Briefly. The first quote is a description of how the first faculty of special reconnaissance was created at Ryazan VDV college (?). The faculty was largely subordinate to GRU, although those who were enrolled externally were indistinguishable from VDV in virtue of going through similar training (jumps) and having the same uniform. The second quote contains Kolmakov’s description of some important structural changes in VDV, particularly the establishment of permanent recon subdivisions within regiments and battalions.
alright, thanks man
Thanks for the Ilumination GazB, I think I read smth about those Pyramids on RIA NOVOSTI but forgot the name
[quote=GazB;2429906]You guessed correctly that the photos were of the ABM system around Moscow. What you got wrong was assuming the missile on the truck was an ICBM, when in fact it is an ABM interceptor missile. (not sure which one myself but it is certainly one of the two missiles used with the Moscow ABM system).
In this extraction, the General talks about the significance of recon units, specifically he stresses the need of establishing reconnaissance on the battalion level which would be used in the interests of battalion commander.
There is no mentioning of regimental reconnaissance. As I wrote it earlier, regimental recon companies were there for a long time now.
The General says that some additional recon units would be incorporated into battalion and divisional structure, which makes sense.
You do a good job posting photos
Девушки-военнослужащие, участвующие в конкурсе "Мисс Красная звезда", выполняют нормативы по стрельбе на учебном полигоне Таманской дивизии Московского военного округа.
Thats the ultimate proof shes a Russian woman - talking on a cell phone...
If any of you know Russian women, you'll understand!
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