Ossetia, and the truth about it - Page 3

SchwartzerPeter · 12-27-2006, 06:51 AM

Well, It does, are u gray pass owner or full citizen?
Dont get me wrong.

mannelig · 12-27-2006, 07:16 AM

full =)

lightfire · 12-27-2006, 09:51 AM

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Could it be, that some people, on their own accord, think the same as the Kremlin does? That maybe the Kremlin is right?

surelly, lots of people in Russia think and talk the same as Leontjev, but what makes such oppinion unconditional TRUTH?

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And what would you prefer this side do?

mediate, keep the hardliners as far as possible from each other, force the conflict sides to seek the best and common solution, offering benefits.

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Answer.
Would yo have
a. Ossetia become part of Russia.
b. Ossetia become independant.
or
c. Ossetia remain in Georgian control for good.

at this moment?neither-first regulate the conflict, clear everything, find as much common agreement as posbl, and then it would be up to the people of Osetia to decide in FREE and OPEN referendum, not the circus we've seen. If it's trully the best for Osetians-let them have the independance, it's just they don't want it, nor do they know what to do with it-so shoutind loudly about independance, Osetia straight away sells it to Russian Federation. In that case, they dream of the same fate as North Osetia-an autonomus republic, right?Anyway, it's not time for that yet, but these frozen conflicts like in Abkhazia as well has taken too long when doing nothing, only flaming the separatist ideas from one side, and growing the hardliners of "return Osetia to Georgia" from another. Didn't Adzharija "wanted to be independent" as well? Look at them now-all that Adzharian separatism colapsed as the card house..

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They guy had his own opinion far before the Kremlin officials position became on place, I'm talking about official position of Kremlin now.

you didn't answer me, what's that "shape" of the guy? Is it insulting other nations, talking lies, falsifying history or present situation, dezinforming and distorting information is his "shape". That's not only my oppinion of what he speaks, and he speaks all that openlly on TV. And what is propoganda? Maybe he's not Geobels and does not spread that kind of level, but still, the guys' "oppinion" smells with dezinformation, disrespect to other nations, willingnes to stimulate hostility against countries, that does not approve Russia and this old-new form of russian nationalism and chauvinism. I am not saying he's talking only about that and does not criticize Kremlin, he does, the times of soviet era propoganda is over, but today it's more subtle, yet still having much the same.

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Why, you, people don`t like Russia so much?

nasty experiences in the past, that you would not probably understand makes many people not to like Russia too much. However, there's no need to overestimate and missinterpret-that's not hatred, nor it is "I don't like Russia with everything in it-people, places, food etc.". It's what russian governments' actions and loud words of certain political or social activists irritates many people, not the russian people or Russia in general.

Alan · 12-27-2006, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lightfire

at this moment?neither-first regulate the conflict, clear everything, find as much common agreement as posbl, and then it would be up to the people of Osetia to decide in FREE and OPEN referendum, not the circus we've seen.

What circus, we've said it time and time again, we want to be either with Russia or by ourselves.

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If it's trully the best for Osetians-let them have the independance, it's just they don't want it, nor do they know what to do with it

Now that's just an idiotic statement. They don't want it, and who the FVCK are you to say that? They've certainly fought for it, died for it, struggled for it.

And you, some random guy with no clue as to the situation there, say they don't want it? Well then...

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-so shoutind loudly about independance, Osetia straight away sells it to Russian Federation. In that case, they dream of the same fate as North Osetia-an autonomus republic, right?

Ayep, they've been shoutin, while being genocided, murdered, and fighting. Pity nobody listened.

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Anyway, it's not time for that yet,

Who the fvuck are you to decide that?
Did your relatives die on Zarsk, in Tskhinval?
Did your people's villages get burned to ash?
Did your children get buried alive?
Did you have to bury loved ones in a schoolyard because the cemetary was getting mortared?

No, I didn't think so. You sat comfortably somewhere, while people died, and now you have the ****ing nerve to say it's not time for them yet?

Do you think you are god? Do you think you actually matter?

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but these frozen conflicts like in Abkhazia as well has taken too long when doing nothing,

Well, maybe if the powers-that-be actually listened for once, or bothered, something would be done?

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only flaming the separatist ideas from one side,

along with flaming villages and corpses of farmers burned on Georgian orders.

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and growing the hardliners of "return Osetia to Georgia" from another.

Forgot more lines..

"Wipe out the ossetian snakes."

"Georgia for Georgians"

"Cleanse the non-Georgian filth to Russia through the Roksky tunnel."

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Didn't Adzharija "wanted to be independent" as well? Look at them now-all that Adzharian separatism colapsed as the card house..

Piss poor comparison. Adjarians are ethnically Georgian, and no war of aggression or Genocide was ever waged against them.

kakheli · 01-09-2007, 08:25 PM

History

[edit] Medieval and early modern period

The Ossetians are originally descendants of Iranian-speaking tribes from Central Asia. They became Christians during the early Middle Ages, under Georgian influence. Under Mongol rule, they were pushed out of their medieval homeland south of the Don river in present-day Russia and part migrated towards and over the Caucasus mountains, to Georgia [5] where they formed three distinct territorial entities. Digor in the west came under the influence of the neighboring Kabard people, who introduced Islam. Tualläg in the south became what is now South Ossetia, part of the historical Georgian principality of Samachablo [6] where Ossetians found refuge from Mongol invaders. Iron in the north became what is now North Ossetia, under Russian rule from 1767. Most Ossetians are now Christian (approximately 61%); there is also a significant Muslim minority.

[edit] South Ossetia under Russia and the Soviet Union

The modern-day South Ossetia was annexed by Russia in 1801, along with Georgia proper, and absorbed into the Russian Empire. Following the Russian Revolution, South Ossetia became a part of the Menshevik Georgian Democratic Republic, while the north became a part of the Terek Soviet Republic. The area saw brief clashes between the Georgian governmental forces and Ossetians led by Ossetian and Georgian bolsheviks in 1920. The Soviet Georgian government established by the Russian 11th Red Army in 1921, created the South Ossetian Autonomous Oblast (i.e. district) in April 1922. Although the Ossetians had their own language (Ossetian), Russian and Georgian were administrative/state languages. [7] At present, Russian is the only administrative language[citation needed] used by the separatist government in Tskhinvali. In the Soviet time, under the rule of Georgia's government, it enjoyed some degree of autonomy, including to practice (Ossetian) language and teach it in schools.

Alan · 01-09-2007, 08:54 PM

Nice article. It kinda forgets two things.

1. The dvalls, a people the ossetians integrated into their population.

2. The entire bit of history where Ossetia existed as Alania prior to the separation during the Soviet Union.

12-27-2006, 06:51 AM	#31
SchwartzerPeter Banned user Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 21	Well, It does, are u gray pass owner or full citizen? Dont get me wrong. Last edited by SchwartzerPeter; 12-27-2006 at 07:09 AM.

12-27-2006, 07:16 AM	#32
mannelig Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Estonia Age: 24 Posts: 937	full =)

01-09-2007, 08:25 PM	#35
kakheli Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 20	History [edit] Medieval and early modern period The Ossetians are originally descendants of Iranian-speaking tribes from Central Asia. They became Christians during the early Middle Ages, under Georgian influence. Under Mongol rule, they were pushed out of their medieval homeland south of the Don river in present-day Russia and part migrated towards and over the Caucasus mountains, to Georgia [5] where they formed three distinct territorial entities. Digor in the west came under the influence of the neighboring Kabard people, who introduced Islam. Tualläg in the south became what is now South Ossetia, part of the historical Georgian principality of Samachablo [6] where Ossetians found refuge from Mongol invaders. Iron in the north became what is now North Ossetia, under Russian rule from 1767. Most Ossetians are now Christian (approximately 61%); there is also a significant Muslim minority. [edit] South Ossetia under Russia and the Soviet Union The modern-day South Ossetia was annexed by Russia in 1801, along with Georgia proper, and absorbed into the Russian Empire. Following the Russian Revolution, South Ossetia became a part of the Menshevik Georgian Democratic Republic, while the north became a part of the Terek Soviet Republic. The area saw brief clashes between the Georgian governmental forces and Ossetians led by Ossetian and Georgian bolsheviks in 1920. The Soviet Georgian government established by the Russian 11th Red Army in 1921, created the South Ossetian Autonomous Oblast (i.e. district) in April 1922. Although the Ossetians had their own language (Ossetian), Russian and Georgian were administrative/state languages. [7] At present, Russian is the only administrative language[citation needed] used by the separatist government in Tskhinvali. In the Soviet time, under the rule of Georgia's government, it enjoyed some degree of autonomy, including to practice (Ossetian) language and teach it in schools.

01-09-2007, 08:54 PM	#36
Alan Banned user Join Date: Feb 2006 Age: 23 Posts: 800	Nice article. It kinda forgets two things. 1. The dvalls, a people the ossetians integrated into their population. 2. The entire bit of history where Ossetia existed as Alania prior to the separation during the Soviet Union.