east-west; End of Communism Cheered but Now with More Reservations

[ATA]

Incredibly good/long/comprehensive read
http://pewglobal.org/reports/display.php?ReportID=267

Nearly two decades after the fall of the Berlin Wall, publics of former Iron Curtain countries generally look back approvingly at the collapse of communism. Majorities of people in most former Soviet republics and Eastern European countries endorse the emergence of multiparty systems and a free market economy.

However, the initial widespread enthusiasm about these changes has dimmed in most of the countries surveyed; in some, support for democracy and capitalism has diminished markedly. In many nations, majorities or pluralities say that most people were better off under communism, and there is a widespread view that the business class and political leadership have benefited from the changes more than ordinary people. Nonetheless, self reported life satisfaction has risen significantly in these societies compared with nearly two decades ago when the Times Mirror Center1 first studied public opinion in the former Eastern bloc.

...

Complete (even longer) report in PDF:
http://pewglobal.org/reports/pdf/267.pdf

[Derbedeu]

It's called nostalgia. Who doesn't remember their youth as a period of "good times"? Besides, it's not as if Germany or other countries don't have generous welfare systems either.

One startling stat is how there is an increase in satisfaction with one's life even though there is a decrease in belief that democracy and capitalism are a good thing. I think it kind of supports my theory that life is better today, and that nostalgia + unrealistic expectations in '91 is what accounts for a decrease in the switch to democracy/capitalism.

Thanks for the report ATA. It's very interesting. I'm looking forward to actually reading the thing instead of just perusing it.

[Rossdobby]

I don't understand why a communist state can't be democratic? Because Communism is an economic model and not so much a political one. The Soviets made it look other wise though. I think Communism would work alongside a democratic government.

[Mango Madness]

Unfavorable Views of Key Minority Groups
% Unfavorable

Bulgaria %
Roma 56
Turks 28

Czech Rep. %
Roma 84
Germans 26

East Germany %
Turks 36
Roma 33

Hungary %
Roma 69
Romanians 33

Lithuania %
Jews 37
Poles 21

Poland %
Russians 41
Ukrainians 35
Jews 29

Russia %
Chechens 60
Georgians 53

Slovakia %
Roma 78
Jews 27

Ukraine %
Georgians 28
Tajiks 18


Interesting...

"Lithuania - Jews 37%". It's hard to believe that they're still so antisemitic, even though there's been practically no Jews there since their near total destruction by their Nazi collaborators. Likewise, Poland 27%, there's been practically no Jews there since the Holocaust.

[hastati]

What is the source of this informations? According do pools in Poland the most disliked nations are Arabs(70% but its not minorityin PL), Roms(65%) and Russians(61%). This are informations from "Gazeta Wyborcza"(most pro-Israeli newspaper in Poland) and they would shurly notice not good score for Jews.

It's called nostalgia. Who doesn't remember their youth as a period of "good times"?

Good point.

[kalerab]

Originally Posted by Mango Madness

Unfavorable Views of Key Minority Groups
% Unfavorable

Bulgaria %
Roma 56
Turks 28

Czech Rep. %
Roma 84
Germans 26

East Germany %
Turks 36
Roma 33

Hungary %
Roma 69
Romanians 33

Lithuania %
Jews 37
Poles 21

Poland %
Russians 41
Ukrainians 35
Jews 29

Russia %
Chechens 60
Georgians 53

Slovakia %
Roma 78
Jews 27

Ukraine %
Georgians 28
Tajiks 18


Interesting...

"Lithuania - Jews 37%". It's hard to believe that they're still so antisemitic, even though there's been practically no Jews there since their near total destruction by their Nazi collaborators. Likewise, Poland 27%, there's been practically no Jews there since the Holocaust.

Where´d you get that from? I hardly believe that anyone in Slovakia even cares about Jews since there were nearly all killed/expelled during WW2 and there is now something like 3000.

[Mango Madness]

Originally Posted by kalerab

Where´d you get that from? I hardly believe that anyone in Slovakia even cares about Jews since there were nearly all killed/expelled during WW2 and there is now something like 3000.

Did you read the report? Page 8

This is what I pointed out in my earlier post, certain countries having negative opinions of certain ethnic groups despite having practically no population of them for many years. Hence the conclusion is it's historical prejudice.

[Derbedeu]

I wonder what Russia would have polled a little over a year ago. Or before '94. Somehow I don't think Georgians or Chechens would have been up there.

[gazell]

Originally Posted by kalerab

Where´d you get that from? I hardly believe that anyone in Slovakia even cares about Jews since there were nearly all killed/expelled during WW2 and there is now something like 3000.

It's in the linked article. I was giggling at the 'key minority' of Romanians in Hungary. (Unless talking about the every now and then influx of Roma from there.) Otherwise, working from a very old map these guys are. Note, no mention of Hungarian minorities in Europe, either.

The current figure of anti-Roma feelings is about the same as the Czechs'.

By the way, you do not need to have a minority to have people dislike them. There are surveys done with imaginary ethnic groups listed, some always express a dislike for those too, all right.

It is not just nostalgia for communism, it's the ignorance of communist time population too, the age groups show it well. Brainwashed people, with complete lack of political culture and economical understanding, that were grown up like cattle. In the case of Hungary, it's interesting to note, that the figures are from 1991 - just after changes and a conservative, center right gov, 2009 - after 2 terms of the "communists' democracy". Their voters fail to realize even that.

[Mango Madness]

Originally Posted by Derbedeu

I wonder what Russia would have polled a little over a year ago. Or before '94. Somehow I don't think Georgians or Chechens would have been up there.

Georgians' unfavourable view was still pretty high. Chechens weren't one of the survey option answers in 1991.

Page 52-

% Unfavourable
1991 2009
Russia % %
Chechens -- 60
Georgians 46 53

[ATA]

well few questions about anti-Semitism (wrong name for that, but) is answered in a report of age groups questioned. As for younger generations there is quite "cosmopolitan" reflections, but older generations have they deep down they still do have prejudice and and discontent...+ I've read there has been some recent "international row's" between few of them and Israel about compensations etc...
The other trend of report had show growing mistrust of "capitalism" and it is understandable, as apart from few pluses of newer system are obvious, negatives are quite clear as well

[gazell]

Originally Posted by ATA

well few questions about anti-Semitism (wrong name for that, but) is answered in a report of age groups questioned. As for younger generations there is quite "cosmopolitan" reflections, but older generations have they deep down they still do have prejudice and and discontent...+ I've read there has been some recent "international row's" between few of them and Israel about compensations etc...

I think, your answer/s might be country specific. Especially, quite a few do not have any Jews left, to speak of.

As for Hungary, the Israeli and American emigrant rich Jewish communist lobby will confirm, there is the regular custom of Satmar beating every morning in every village, it has been a centuries long practice also.

We just need to use puppets nowadays as we murdered them all in WWII. One patchy story this of a nonsense.

No, it's mostly youngsters here, who have non-tolerance kind of symptoms.

The nutty religious fanatic clubs of Judaism and their teachings of superiority to all others are driving anti-Semitism big way, so does Israel's support of their nuttery.

We have a fair share of Jewish racists here. I do not know of any compensation case problems, that's because it is also handled and chaired by the Jewish communist clans.

Politics is a bit complicated.

Now, as the communists' descendants party's popularity is down some reasonable Jews are starting come out of the shadows. One just wrote an article - and it was published! - about what a shame it is that a lot of Jews still live in the fallacy that they need to be with the left. And then about the scandal about a Jewish communists chaired organisation, who sort of turned out -through leaking of legal documents - forgetting to pay some millions of US dollars out to eligible Holocaust sufferers. That's them, comrades.

As your questions are not too specific, I do not really know, how better to answer.

[ATA]

@ Gazell:
Irriti'sm! (from word irritate)- not anti-Semitism that's all I wanted to point out...

[gazell]

Originally Posted by ATA

@ Gazell:
Irriti'sm! (from word irritate)- not anti-Semitism that's all I wanted to point out...

We are not even irritated as yet, as most of I'd say. There just needs to be an honest and fair public/political/historical treatment of these issues. Otherwise, phew. I don't even like to think.