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#1 | |
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Banned user
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: In The Desolate Deserts Dune's
Posts: 3,362
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(Sorry - this is partially Military related, but I'm not exactly sure if this belongs in the political discussion or off-topic so I just posted it here. Mods, feel free to move this.)
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Your thoughts please EDIT - The article is from: www.muslimheritage.com Last edited by Ayura; 02-16-2006 at 06:28 PM. |
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#2 |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: YOUR place on MY place.
Posts: 13,112
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Good read. I'm buddhist.Does make it seem Islam the is the ultimate religion. I'd never convert anyways. Just not into blind faith.
Last edited by ed316; 02-16-2006 at 05:21 PM. |
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#3 | |
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Banned user
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: In The Desolate Deserts Dune's
Posts: 3,362
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Quote:
Doesn't make a difference. Glad you enjoyed it. |
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#4 |
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Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 194
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What a pile of horse ****.
A complete rewriting of history in favor of muslims and outright denials of events such as the slavery and piracy in Algeirs. What were the barbary wars fought over? |
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#5 | |
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Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 194
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Here's some of that tolerance in Spain that you speak of:
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#6 |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Never Ever Land
Posts: 1,835
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didn't say anything about the beheading of 900+ boys and men of the conquered Makkah. Or the caravan robberies conducted to finance his campaigns....hmmmm....
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#7 |
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Lao Redneck
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: BITCH!!!! I done told you!!
Posts: 18,079
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Make it sound Islam IS THE RELIGION. The Guy who wrote it is probably the Pat Robertson of Islam. Islam=not my cup of tea.
PS. Ayura, where is the link so we can see where this article came from? Last edited by Ezekiel25:17; 02-16-2006 at 06:10 PM. |
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#8 | |
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Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 194
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#9 | |
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Banned user
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: In The Desolate Deserts Dune's
Posts: 3,362
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Quote:
The original post has been edited which displays the link at the bottom. |
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#10 | |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Proudly An Italian American
Age: 41
Posts: 1,875
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Quote:
I have visited a few Muslims countries in these last years but I remember particularly a trip to Sulawesi, Indonesia, circa 7 years ago. Travelling from south to north of it, a group of 10 of us friends, passed trhu' a number of villages. Some of them Christians and at least one Muslim. I still remember that incredible feeling I experienced in my two days stay in the Muslim village. It really did strike me the difference and if I had to find the words to describe it, I'd probably use light and darkness concepts myself. I do not consider myself a racist (my best friend is Arab, though not a Muslim). I reckon I still need to learn and investigate a lot, and I'm trying to do so but in all honesty this is what I feel at the moment. |
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#11 | |
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Banned user
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Vantage Point
Posts: 689
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Have you ever read the history of Crusades? What about the noble Crusaders grilling children alive in Antioch, or slaughtering anybody they could get their hands on in Jerusalem? What caused Sallahuddin's ("Saladin") war that resulted in the defeat of Crusader States in Palestina? Wasn't it a "caravan robbery" by specific European prince, who not only killed ever man in that caravan, but also raped Sallahuddin's sister? What about mediaval pogroms on Jews in Europe (each Crusade began with one), or about the pogrom of Jews in Carist Russia of the 19th Century (which saw a demise of more Jews than in WWII)? All forgotten? "They are all utterly wrong, Christians, Moslems, Jews and all the others who misuse religion" - citate of an Arabic chronist from Antioch, in the mid-11th Century... |
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#12 | |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Opening my mouth and inserting my foot.
Posts: 4,137
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#13 | |
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Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 194
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Quote:
He just disputed the very pro-muslim slant in this article that makes it seem that Islam is a religion that never commited atrocities. Christians can admit to their violent past and can admit to faults in their present day but muslims can not seem to do the same. |
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#14 | |
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Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 155
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Quote:
He gathered them by the Kaaba (big black cube that was built by Abrahim and Ismaeel) and he asked them: "what do you expect me to do with you?" They replied in fear expecting revenge: "you are a good relative and you are kind." He replied "Go...for you are the free" Yes prophet Muhammad was warrior prophet and he had empire... but his humblness and mercy was why he was sent to the people of earth. Now comparing Muslims today with the times of the prophet... there is no comparison... |
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#15 | |
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Banned user
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Vantage Point
Posts: 689
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Add to this that Muhammad did not need to "conquer" Damascus - which was the first major city he "took": the local citizens gladly accepted his rule if he only would protect them against the Byzantine (Christian) terror...
In clear text: it's not the religion - as an idea - that is "dark" or "light" here. It's what people interpret of it. Like modern-day Christianity is actually based on the Bible, so also Islam is based on Qoran. So much about the theory. In reality, the "problem" with Islam is that Qoran can be properly understood only in Arabic language, and is not especially specific in certain "instructions" it provides; plus, there is no single clerical leader in the Islamic world, but rather a number of sects, each of which interpret the holly book in a different way. Even more so, each of Islamic sects interprets differently how strictly or in which way should specific parts of Qoran be understood. Correspondingly, it's easy to misinterpret Qoran to a mass of people. In fact, in essence, one gets a situation in which various people can interpret various suras from Qoran in a completely different way. Obviously, this is not ideal. But, it must be said that the current problem stems from the times when local rulers - and especially Turkish Sultans - massively misused Qoran to keep population dumb, and themselves in power (which is nothing else but what the Catholic church was exercising for centuries too). The rest was delivered by Crusades (which resulted in the extremism in the Islamic world [begining with "hashashins/assasins", suicide killers, that came into existence as a kind of a "special sect" used for political murders]), as well as purposeful suppression of the Islamic world by the West, in the last 100 years. Originally, Islam was actually a very progressive, advanced, human and tollerant (towards "infidels") religion for its times, only slightly behind the Zaratrustrian teachings in Persia - as can be seen from how well the Arabs used to live, and how high their culture developed at the times of the Khalifates. And, while the original Prophet Muhammad's campaign for spread of Islam is frequently explained as a kind of a brutal and very bloody war, the matter of fact remains that half of his conquers were achieved through negotiations (see the example of Damascus, which was definitely the most important event for the development of Islam). That some of his followers began to misuse his religion immediately after Mohammad's death is truth, but again not his or the fault of his religion. So, when "AceofBase" complains that, "nobody said the Christians were better": you can't sellect to see Islam as a religion of darkness, uneducation, and poverty, and therefore comment about articles like the one with which this thread was launched to have a "very pro-muslim slant". Take a look at the whole picture. Like in Christianity, there are specific reasons why specific parts of the Islamic world live the way they do. And, this - by far - does not mean that Islam as a whole is "bad" or people "must" be against it in general. Quote:
But, you should not misinterpret the fact that most of Moslems live under oppressive regimes that massively misuse religion for their own purposes - as their unpreparedness to do something similar. It is a matter of fact that these regimes - most of which were put in power by the West and thus imposed on their people, or climbed to power in reaction to Western invasions and/or interventions - do not have any interest to rise the level of education of their people, and do not care about improving living standards of majority of their population. A good example for this is the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, where unemployment is reaching 40% and the royals stuff their pockets with almost 70% of the country's income, while leaving a mass of population at mercy of one of Islamic sects. This "organisation" of the Saudi society is based on a "pact" between the royals and local clerigy, according to which the later does not steer unrest against the royals, as long as it gets extensive financial support from them. Should religion be brandished for this? Inspite of one of official titles of the Saudi King being, "defender of religion" - the answer is definitely negative. |
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